Turkish Forum

Tag: Turkish

  • VAN REBELLION BY ARMENIANS: IT WAS THE 9/11 FOR THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE

    VAN REBELLION BY ARMENIANS: IT WAS THE 9/11 FOR THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE

    Why is it that the Muslim victims at the hands of Armenian nationalists during WWI is almost always ignored?

    According to the “Dictionary of WWI” by Stephen Pope & Elizabeth-Anne Wheal, 2003, ISBN 0 85052 979-4, page 34, 120,000 Muslims, mostly Turkish, were killed by Armenian nationalists in 1914.

    And that does not even take into account the infamous Van Rebellion by Armenians in April of 1915.

    Why is it so difficult to comprehend that the Van Revolt by Armenians—where about 40,000 Muslim inhabitants of the town were cut down by Armenians and the city was turned over to Russian invader—is the EQUIVALENT TO 9/11 FOR THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE?

    Consider this: The U.S. crossed oceans and continents to wage a trillion dollar global war on terrorism because about 3,000 of its citizens were killed on American soil. Why is it, then, so difficult to understand that the Ottoman Empire, having lost 120,000 of its citizens, resorted to similar , but much lesser, measures of TERESET (Temporary Resettlement) of the perpetrators?

    Rephrased, how can 3,000 victims in 2001 justify a international, global war, but 120,000 victims in 1914 (and many more in 1915) do not justify even a domestic, local TERESET ?

    Values and concepts like fairness, balance, double standards, religious bias, ethnic bigotry, racial prejudice, defamation, demonization, and others seem to all come into play here…

    24TH OF APRIL, 1915: IT IS THE BEGINNING OF OTTOMAN GUANTANAMO, NOT A BOGUS GENOCIDE

    Why is it so hard to see that the 24th of April, 1915, is the beginning of OTTOMAN GUANTANAMO, not the bogus genocide. On that day, some 237 Armenian suspects (not thousands as claimed) of treason were arrested and sent to central Anatolia, to places like Corum, and subjected to house arrest, which meant they could roam around during the day but had to check into a designated house at night. Not exactly even Guantanamo, is it? All of them were returned in the end, except two. They were murdered but on unrelated matters of money and trade. No matter how one slices it, this does not sound like genocide, does it?

    Here is, then, the forest for those who miss it because of a tree or two: Turks and Armenians had lived in a relatively harmonious cohabitation in Anatolia for nearly a millennium before the Armenian took up arms against their own government towards the end of that millennium (i.e. 1894-1915). Had the Armenians (and others) not taken up arms against their own neighbors, co-citizens, and government, they would have still been living in Anatolia today, just like the Armenians of Istanbul who mostly stayed loyal to the Ottoman Empire .

    Since when, then, defending one’s home a genocide?

    Would America behave differently today if three million Americans (roughly equivalent of 120,000 Ottomans killed by Armenians) were mercilessly killed by some insurgent groups who then enthusiastically joined the enemy armies equally brutally invading America?

    Please!

  • ARMENIAN PROPAGANDA WINS, FOR NOW

    ARMENIAN PROPAGANDA WINS, FOR NOW

    Boston Globe reports that a federal appeals court yesterday ruled that statewide public school guidelines on teaching human rights history can exclude materials disputing that the mass slaying of Armenians in the First World War era constituted genocide. Below, please read the article first and then my reaction to it.
    ***
    SCHOOLS CAN EXCLUDE MATERIALS DISPUTING ARMENIAN GENOCIDE

    Court ruled on 1999 case
    By Peter Schworm , Boston Globe Staff / August 12, 2010
    In a closely watched case, a federal appeals court yesterday ruled that statewide public school guidelines on teaching human rights history can exclude materials disputing that the mass slaying of Armenians in the First World War era constituted genocide.
    The decision, written by retired Supreme Court justice David Souter, who occasionally hears cases with the First Circuit Court of Appeals, found that state education officials did not violate public school students’ free speech rights in 1999, when they excluded all “contra-genocide’’ sources calling the Armenian genocide into question.
    Van Z. Krikorian, a professor at Pace University Law School who filed a brief defending the state’s move, said he was thrilled by the ruling, equating those who dispute the genocide designation to Holocaust deniers.
    “It would have put human rights education in reverse,’’ he said. “It’s a major defeat for genocide denial.’’
    Upholding a lower-court decision, the court ruled that although state guidelines were advisory, and “not meant to declare other positions out of bounds in study and discussion,’’ they were part of the official curriculum and therefore under the discretion of state authorities.
    Requiring that officials include references to dissenting viewpoints, Souter wrote, “might actually have the effect of foreclosing future opportunities for open enquiry in the classroom.’’
    Harvey Silverglate, a Boston civil rights lawyer representing the Assembly of Turkish American Associations, had argued that removing the references amounted to government censorship and prevented students from hearing both sides.
    “It always is a sad day when a court constricts First Amendment rights rather than expand them,’’ he said. “I think they made a mistake.’’ Silverglate said his clients will consider whether to appeal.
    The Turkish-American group disputes that the Muslim Turkish Ottoman Empire committed genocide against its Christian Armenian minority population. Over 1.5 million Armenians died at the hands of Turkish forces, but Turkish activists maintain it was not the result of a policy.
    In 1998, the Legislature ordered the state Board of Education to prepare an advisory curriculum guide for teaching about genocide and human rights, and a draft of the guide initially included a section on the “Armenian Genocide.’’ Under pressure from Turkish advocacy groups, the commissioner of education, David P. Driscoll, revised the draft to include references to opposing views, said the ruling.

    When officials filed the guide with legislators in March 1999, the state’s Armenian community protested the inclusion of “contra-genocide’’ viewpoints, and the education commissioner removed the references.
    Peter Schworm can be reached at [email protected].
    ***

    ARMENIAN PROPAGANDA WINS, FOR NOW
    Jewish Holocaust is supported by due process and a court verdict by a competent tribunal (Nuremberg, 1945.) What due process and court verdict support Armenian claims of genocide? The answer might surprise you: none! That’s right, Armenian claims are based on a racist and dishonest version of history, not law or the truth. They are racist because they ignore the Turkish victims at the hands of Armenian revolutionaries (120,000 in the year 1914 alone, according to the dictionary of World War One, by Stephen Pope and Elizabeth-Anne Wheal, 2003, page 34.) And they are dishonest because they simply dismiss the six T’s of the Turkish-Armenian conflict. Too bad, our children in Boston will never know that the Armenians took up arms against their own government. Too bad the “poor, starving Armenians myth” will be ingrained in their brains like zombies, never seeing the photos of the Armenian ultra-nationalists armed to the teeth (www.ethocide.com ) They’ll never hear about the Armenians revolts, terrorism, treason, territorial demands and more. Just because a “sundown town” ruling by a misinformed judge said so. The decision must be appealed in the spirit of independence in 1776, anti-slavery in 1862, and civil rights of 1960s.

    BIAS & BIGOTRY IN THE TERM “ARMENIAN GENOCIDE”
    If one cherishes values like fairness, objectivity, truth, and honesty, then one should really use the term “Turkish-Armenian conflict”. Asking one “Do you accept or deny Armenian Genocide” shows anti-Turkish bias. The question should be re-phrased “What is your stand on the Turkish-Armenian conflict?”
    Turks believe it was an inter communal warfare mostly fought by Turkish and Armenian irregulars, a civil war which is engineered, provoked, and waged by the Armenian revolutionaries, with active support from Russia, England, France, and others, all eyeing the vast territories of the collapsing Ottoman Empire, against a backdrop of a raging world war.
    Armenians, on the other hand, totally ignoring Armenian agitation, raids, rebellions, treason, territorial demands, and Turkish victims killed by Armenians, unfairly claim that it was a one way genocide.

    GENOCIDE ALLEGATIONS IGNORE “THE SIX T’S OF THE TURKISH-ARMENIAN CONFLICT”
    While some in unsuspecting public may be forgiven for taking the blatant and ceaseless Armenian propaganda at face value and believing Armenian falsifications merely because they are repeated so often, it is difficult and painful for the children of Turkish survivors of hate crimes committed by Armenian nationalists and other Christians. Those seemingly endless “War years” of 1912-1922 brought wide-spread death and destruction on to all Ottoman citizens. No Turkish family was left touched, mine included. Those nameless, faceless Turkish victims are killed for a second time today with politically motivated and baseless charges of Armenian genocide. Those six T’s which are censored by an ill-informed judge are:
    1) TUMULT (as in numerous Armenian armed uprisings between 1894 and 1920)
    2) TERRORISM (by well-armed Armenian nationalists and militias victimizing Ottoman-Muslims between 1882-1920)
    3) TREASON (Armenians joining the invading enemy armies as early as 1914 and lasting until 1921)
    4) TERRITORIAL DEMANDS (where Armenians were a minority, not a majority, attempting to establish Greater Armenia, the would-be first apartheid of the 20th Century with a Christian minority ruling over a Muslim majority )
    5) TURKISH SUFFERING AND LOSSES (i.e. those caused by the Armenian nationalists: 524,000 Muslims, mostly Turks, met their tragic end at the hands of Armenian revolutionaries during WWI, per Turkish Historical Society. This figure is not to be confused with about 2.5 million Muslim dead who lost their lives due to non-Armenian causes during WWI. Grand total: more than 3 million, according to Prof. Justin McCarthy.)
    6) TERESET (temporary resettlement) triggered by the first five T’s above and amply documented as such; not to be equated to the Armenian misrepresentations as genocide.)

    VERDICT WITHOUT DUE PROCESS AMOUNTS TO LYNCHING
    Those who take the Armenian “allegations” of genocide at face value seem to also ignore the following:
    1- Genocide is a legal, technical term precisely defined by the U.N. 1948 convention (Like all proper laws, it is not retroactive to 1915.)
    2- Genocide verdict can only be given by a “competent court” after “due process” where both sides are properly represented and evidence mutually cross examined.
    3- For a genocide verdict, the accusers must prove “intent” at a competent court and after due process. This could never be done by the Armenians whose evidence mostly fall into five major categories: hearsay, mis-representations, exaggerations, forgeries, and “other”.
    4- Such a “competent court” was never convened in the case of Turkish-Armenian conflict and a genocide verdict does not exist (save a Kangaroo court in occupied Istanbul in 1920 where partisanship, vendettas, and revenge motives left no room for due process.)
    5- Genocide claim is political, not historical or factual. It reflects bias against Turks. Therefore, the term genocide must be used with the qualifier “alleged”, for scholarly objectivity and truth.

    HISTORY IS A MATTER OF SCHOLARSHIP, NOT CONSENSUS
    History is not a matter of “conviction, consensus, political resolutions, political correctness, or propaganda.” History is a matter of research, peer review, thoughtful debate, and honest scholarship. Even historians, by definition, cannot decide on a genocide verdict, which is reserved for a “competent court” with its legal expertise and due process.

    POLITICAL LYNCHING OF THE TURKS BY ARMENIANS TODAY
    What we witness today amounts to lynching of the Turks by Armenians to satisfy the age old Armenian hate, bias, and bigotry. Values like fairness, presumption of innocence until proven guilty, objectivity, balance, honesty, and freedom of speech are stumped under the fanatic Armenian feet. Unprovoked , unjustified, and unfair defamation of Turkey, one of America’s closest allies in the troubled Middle East, in order to appease some nagging Armenian activists runs counter to American interests.
    Those who claim genocide verdict today, based on the much discredited Armenian evidence, are actually engaging in “conviction and execution without due process”. Last time I looked in the dictionary, that was the definition of “lynching”.
    FREEDOM OF SPEECH? WHAT FREEDOM?

    This unfortunate and racist decision promoting Armenian propaganda over honest scholarship and civil dialogue, turns Boston into a SUNDOWN TOWN. Remember those towns, thousands of them coast to coast that sprang up during the NADIR PERIOD OF RACE RELATIONS in America, i.e. roughly 1890-1940, where signs told so-called COLORED PEOPLE TO LEAVE TOWN BY SUNDOWN or else live with the consequences, which meant death by lynching?
    Freedom of speech is dealt such a terrible blow by this SUNDOWN TOWN DECISION by an ill-informed judge today: 11 August 2010. What a sad day for America, , indeed….

  • Turkish PM: Some European countries not doing enough in PKK fight

    Turkish PM: Some European countries not doing enough in PKK fight

    Turkish Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan on Wednesday accused some European countries of turning a blind eye to the activities of the Kurdistan Workers’ Party (PKK).

    Turkish Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan on Wednesday accused some European countries of not doing enough to help Turkey in its fight against the outlawed Kurdistan Workers’ Party (PKK).

    “Some European countries did not give necessary support to Turkey in its combat against terrorism for a long time,” said Erdogan at a meeting of the Southeast European Cooperation Process (SEECP) in Istanbul, according to the state-run Anatolian Agency.

    “Despite all the pain we have been through and bloody attacks on civilians and security forces, today, there are countries who have not cut financial support to the terrorist organization, who turned a blind eye to its activities and its propaganda, and who did not extradite any criminals to Turkey.” he continued.

    Erdogan’s statement comes in the midst of escalating clashes between Turkish forces and the PKK. More than 40 Turkish soldiers have died in the last few months as the result of PKK attacks.

    Both the United States and the European Union list the PKK as a terrorist organization.

    Police in Istanbul Wednesday detained 27 people in connection with the previous day’s bombing of a military bus.

    Four soldiers and the 17-year-old daughter of an officer were killed in the attack, which has been claimed by an offshoot of the PKK.

    The bus was struck by a remote control bomb that had been planted by the roadside.

    In his speech, Erdogan said that European security is connected to the security in cities in eastern Turkey, where many of the recent clashes have taken place.

    “Security in Europe, particularly the Balkans, starts in Hakkari, in Semdinli. You should know that security of Balkan and European countries can not be restored before security is restored in Semdinli,” Erdogan said.

    “Most of our European friends announced PKK as terrorist organization. That is good, but declaring PKK as terrorist organization does not put an end to the matter. How many terrorists have you extradited to us from those you have detained?” Erdogan added.

    Haaretz

  • ATAA IS AS VERSATILE, VIBRANT, AND RESOURCEFUL AS EVER

    ATAA IS AS VERSATILE, VIBRANT, AND RESOURCEFUL AS EVER

    Re: “Better or worse days for the ATAA?” , by İLHAN TANIR, Friday, February 5, 2010 ;

    Rebuttal by Ergun KIRLIKOVALI

    I thank Mr. Tanir, HDN reporter based in Washington DC, for taking the time to chat with President Evinch and I over the phone on 3 February 2010. That’s a first and I appreciate it. My message was simple and I think he got it: if Hurriyet Daily News (HDN) wishes to cover Turkish-American issues objectively, then HDN should make an effort to talk to Turkish-Americans first, along with others who HDN may see fit.

    The problem with the recent unfortunate HDN coverage arose because HDN reporter in that case failed to get the input of the Turkish-Americans in a matter closely related to them. Had the HDN reporter done so, we would have filled him in on points, that even Mr. Tanir agrees, the previous article missed. I am glad to hear that Mr. Tanir will work closely with us in future to avoid a needless lack of communication. To me, then, this whole unfortunate episode is water under the bridge and we all learned something from it. Chalk it off to experience.

    Having said that, though, I must express my initial reaction to Mr. Tanir’s article as slight disappointment as he seems to have missed what I was trying to emphasize during our telephone conversation. I know he means well so I will not lose any sleep over it, but I would like him to know that I am not against including dissenting points of view in any media, HDN or others. What I am against is including dissenting points of view to the exclusion of my point of view, and the views held by others like myself in our community.

    I can effortlessly pinpoint to many articles published in HDN that directly concern our community–as all Turkish-American relations matter to us–and where the ideas and views presented diametrically clash with those held in our community. I cannot, however, point a single article where ATAA views are solicited, urged, or otherwise presented in response (the jury is still out on this letter you are reading now.) No op-ed, no article, no survey, not anything. .. What is worse, there had been no efforts by HDN to do so, that is , not until my letter to HDN editor crossed Mr. Tanir’s desk. That kind of lopsided coverage at HDN is what I am against, not publishing of dissenting views there. Let’s please make that clear to one and all.

    Maybe Mr. Tanir can be kind enough to explain what he means by “…The ATAA, unfortunately, has not had a good reputation among the Turkish community living in America until recently for its internal fights…” Is not this the kind of sweeping and unfair generalizations that sparked this incident in the first place?

    Just because one group disagreed with another, a common occurrence within all volunteer organizations, shall we stamp “bad reputation nationwide” over the name of that organization? Does Mr Tanir realize that the United States is perhaps the most litigious society on earth and that if he writes off everyone involved in litigation, he would have no one to report on in America? Please, let’s not go overboard with generalizations.

    Then Mr Tanir notes “… (ATAA) has become mostly a grassroots organization that uses almost all its energy, time and money to fight the Armenian diaspora’s efforts, especially before and during the April 24 fever every year …” Here is another generalization with which I have problems. Perhaps if Mr. Tanir gets to know ATAA better, he would correct himself.

    First, ATAA was founded as a grassroots organization and performed as such through its volunteers nationwide since day one.

    Second, we are not fighting “Armenian diaspora’s efforts”; we are fighting defamation of Turkish culture and heritage and demonization of all things Turkish. Whoever is engaged in such practices, that is with whom ATAA fights. It just so happens that mostly Armenian and Greek Diasporas seem to be engaged in such malicious practices and ATAA has been directing its resources towards those practices.

    Where Mr. Tanir makes probably his gravest mistake is this: “…especially before and during the April 24 fever every year …” That is a cliché that is no longer true as the Armenian lobby (not diaspora, lobby) saw to it that the scope and depth of its efforts to defame and demonize Turkey are widened, deepened, and spread over twelve months of a year. I can effortlessly provide you with lists of articles, op-eds, books, panels, meetings, commemorations, services, films, exhibits, and more for each and every month, even week, of the year. So, please, let’s kindly stay away from obsolete clichés and sweeping generalizations.

    Mr. Tanir comments “… when the American administration announces how it considers and words the tragic events that happened to the Armenians during World War I…” This is a typical line that shows indifference that I hear people often say when I visit Turkey. Some have not heard of the Armenian issue; others simply do not understand the gravity of the genocide charges; while most have not read a single book, pro or con, about it. Some even think “What’s in a word?” They don’t understand the four-phase Armenian lobby plan (acceptance-apology-reparations-land) to harm and destabilize Turkey. They have no clue that if the U.S. Congress accepts the Armenian falsifications as genocide, then the flood gates open.

    To date, for instance, there are no countries in Asia or Africa and only three in the entire Americas that recognized the alleged genocide, upon intense political pressure by the Armenian lobby. There are 15 countries which recognized the genocide claims in some form in Europe, out of a possible 55 countries. That makes a total of about 20 countries worldwide which recognized the bogus genocide, which in turn, is only about 10% of the world community. So all those books, films, museums, memorials, propaganda, agitation, violent demonstrations, flag burnings, bombings, assassinations, terrorist acts, and persistent lobbying, and more, over almost a century, got Armenians only the 10% of the world. Perhaps not much to write home about, right?

    With US recognition, though, all this can change in a hurry. Pro-genocide countries can reach 80-90% of the United Nations within a few short years. That is how important US President’s approval of genocide is, which, ironically, would make a mockery of the U.S. Congress’ own records because of the following documents, among many others, that clearly refute the Armenian claims of genocide:

    a- “American Military Mission to Armenia” (General Harbord) Report 1920 and the Annex Report Nat. Archives 184.021/175 – which does not mention any “race extermination” but, on the contrary, refers to “…refinements of cruelty by Armenians to Muslims…”

    b- Joint U.S. CONGRESS RESOLUTION NO. 192, APRIL 22, 1922 relative to the activities of Near East Relief ending 31 December 1921 which has unanimously resolved that a total of 1,414,000 Armenians were alive (which makes killing of 1.5 million Armenians an impossibility, since the total Armenian population was around 1.5 million at the time.)

    c- George Montgomery, a member of the U.S. delegation at the Paris Conference, had presented a detailed tabulation in 1919, showing a total of 1,104,000 Armenians alive, apart from those who had already immigrated to other countries.

    d- 29 March 1919 report of the Paris Conference subcommittee on atrocities, chaired by the U.S. secretary of State Lansing, lists Armenian losses as “…more than 200,000…” Even this number is exaggerated as they got their information from the Armenian church, not exactly an impartial source. The Turkish Historical Society documented the deaths of 53,000 Armenians using Ottoman police reports field on site, of which number only about 8,400 are reported as victims of massacres. The paragraphs a, b, and c jointly point to the THS number being closer to reality.

    Who, then may have jacked this number of Armenian casualties from the original 54,000 first to 200,000 in March 1919, 600,000 in May 1919 (in a poster created by Armenians) to the current 1.5 million?

    Take a guess!

    Going back to Mr. Tanir’s article, he asserts “…being tied to (genocide) struggle only, in addition to the never-ending internal fights – until recently …” Another unfounded generalization that totally ignores ATAA’s many excellent programs (please see www.ataa.org ) and uses an unfairly broad brush to paint the only litigation in ATAA’s history of 31 years as “never-ending” infighting.

    Mr. Tanir states “…narrow-minded and reactionary organization that turned me, along with many others, off over the years…” So a single litigation in 31 years turned him off of ATAA?

    Selfless fight against defamation of all things Turkish by incessantly-hate-cultivating Armenian lobby turned him, along with other journalists off? If Mr. Tanir reads a book by another Turkish journalist, who shall remain nameless for now and whose book I have read last year, about the state of Turkish journalists in America, he would know who is turned off by who. Please, let’s not try to white wash ineptness of some journalists by what ATAA did or didn’t do. I will abstain from giving examples at this time.

    Mr. Tanir claims “… I was saddened at hearing a point of view that usually would not be expected from a person who will assume an important position representing the Turkish community in America…” This point of view, as you wrongly stated in your article, was not being against publishing dissenting views but it was publishing it at the expense of my views. Journalistic ethics and objectivity require that “Both sides” of an issue be provided to unsuspecting readers. What is so strange about this? Why stick to one side and ignore the other?

    By the way, if you had your finger on the pulse of our community, you would know how difficult it is, if not impossible, to get an op-ed published in Los Angeles Times, the Boston Globe, and the New York Times. How come these papers, who used to use the qualifier “alleged” before the term genocide until late 1990s, all of a sudden “decided” to forego such practice after intense Armenian pressure?

    NYT would not even publish a paid public announcement by Turkish American scholars and intellectuals in 2002 ruling it “against the consensus”. Modern psychology defines the term “critical thinking” which contradicts the concept of consensus, relegating it to “groupthink”.

    So, let me get this right: No eyebrows are raised when the big media can censor and HDN can ignore our views, but when we complain about it, HDN reporter becomes “… saddened at hearing a point of view that usually would not be expected from…” an ATAA leader? Guess who is saddened more.

    Mr. Tanir adds “…I disagreed with his complaining about the Hürriyet Daily News just because it gives space to different opinions, including opinion pieces that run contrary to the official Turkish state policies in many matter….” There multiple errors here.

    1) I am not against giving space to different opinions at HDN; I am against doing this at the expense of our views being ignored. Big difference, right? I tried to explain this many times during our chat. For good measure, I am also making it a matter of record here.

    2) About “…including opinion pieces that run contrary to the official Turkish state policies…”, I guess we need to get Mr. Tanir sensitized a little bit with your loose descriptions. They may sadden and disappoint us, but more importantly, they can get him in trouble. ATAA is an American institution with American citizens as members. It is illegal to promote the interests of a foreign government in America without registering as a lobbyist first. By sloppily implying that ATAA promote official (Turkish) state positions , Mr. Tanir is implying we are unregistered lobbyists, not volunteers educating the Americans on Turkish culture and promoting better understanding between Turkey and America. We, as ATAA and Turkish Americans, have absolutely no say on Turkish state policies, nor do we always with all of them. If you read my articles (and there are quite a few) you will realize that I even criticize Turkish government from time to time. Please, try to be more meticulous with your sweeping characterizations.

    Mr. Tanir concludes with “…ATAA tries to do better work and I am ready to give the group the benefit of the doubt, even if I disagree sharply with some of its perspectives…” Would Mr. Tanir please tell us what those perspectives are with which he disagrees? I am very curious.

    Mr. Tanir, while I appreciate your time spent with me and President Evinch, I must say I am disappointed with the obsolete clichés, sweeping generalizations, and sloppy implications you felt you had to include.

    Most Armenians and their sympathizers disagree with the Turkish position on the historical controversy surrounding the interpretation of Ottoman-Armenian history and that is understandable. But none of this means that the Turks, Turkish-Americans, and ATAA are advocating against these people. To make such interpretation is to grossly misunderstand the nature and value of free speech in the United States.

    To censor contra-genocide views on account that they may suggest revision to history is also misguided and against America’s core values. It suggests that there is a widely accepted version of what truth shall be, a “groupthink”, about issues that need further research and debate, sort like legislation of scholarship which in itself is a disturbing notion. Freedom of expression is at the core of everything and we must all practice what we preach. It is a far greater evil to stunt debate and curtail free speech (as big media in America frequently attempt to do in our case) than it is to advocate for a broader interpretation of any controversy.

    After all, History is not a matter of belief, convictions, or gut feelings; it is a matter of research, peer review, debate, and revision to include the emerging truth. History of 100 years ago, or 50 years ago, or even 10 years ago is continually changing with every bit of new archives opened or exposed, every new document “declassified”, every information placed in circulation after being held secret. Revision, if done scholarly and properly, is not only good, but required for a vibrant society.

    The ability to explore and discuss controversial issues in a reasoned, civilized, and scholarly manner is one of the things that make the Turkish American community a rich and vibrant place. I hope to reach a future phase fast where we can understand each other better.

    I find our exchange thoughtful, considerate, and very useful. So, by all means, Mr. Tanir should please keep in touch.

  • SUKRU AYA’S LETTER TO OBAMA RESPONDING TO ANCA CLAIMS

    SUKRU AYA’S LETTER TO OBAMA RESPONDING TO ANCA CLAIMS

    https://armenians-1915.blogspot.com/2009/08/2940-aya-s-letter-to-obama-versus-ancas.html

    August 28, 2009 ergun_s

    Much Esteemed and beloved Mr. President,

    Salute, regards, and sentiments from Türkiye, the country where your friendly visit, is treasured!

    As soon as I read the rude, accusatory, and outright disrespectful letter (see below) written to you by Kenneth V. Hachikian, Chairman of ANCA—a shady group currently under investigation by federal agencies for alleged campaign finance and lobbying violations—I felt compelled to write to you and put some light on penned slanders!

    The letter, [quite short of accustomed courtesy and respect when addressing the White House] was urging you to reject the recent ruling of a three judge panel of the U.S. Court of Appeals for the Ninth Circuit in the case of Movsesian v. Versicherung A.G. (No. 07-56722, August 20, 2009), which struck down a California special-interest law providing remedies and tax exemptions to ethnic Armenians for alleged wrongs during an alleged genocide.

    I should like to emphasize that because of my affection to too many American or Turkish Armenians with whom I have shared many joys and sorrows of my life and continue to have warm, friendly relations, I have compiled a book using anti-Turkish, (mostly Armenian, American) and neutral sources, which took me some four years. A copy will be mailed to you by my friends in USA as annex to this letter, for your further guidance with more than 2000 verbatim excerpts from books, documents, articles etc. that cannot be refuted by any party. The book has been on the “Open Free E-Book Library” of “Armenians-1915.blogspot.com” “a small group of truth dedicated Turkish Armenians, striving for the normalization of relations and discovery of truth and protection of the present Turkish-Armenians friendly relations”, from the continuous interceptions of diaspora organizations, which for nearly a century have established a “trade or industry of marketing hatred and revenge”, and for which they collect a huge amount of money, some disposed as needed or embezzled during the process!

    Apparently, no one taught these Armenians about the separation of powers in U.S.A. and that it is un-American for the executive branch to contravene the judicial branch (or legislative branch). Such discriminated practices may be all right in Armenia, {a land-locked, poverty-stricken, corrupt, aggressive, and violent Armenia living on the donations and instructions by diaspora groups} but it is frowned upon in America.

    The disrespectful Armenian letter writer also seemed ignorant of the federal supremacy law, which says state laws cannot replace, void, or overrule federal laws. The wily and tricky Armenian lobby thought they found the short cut, by applying local political pressure to get a tailor-made state law to bypass all federal laws. Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals saw to it, that those Armenian falsifiers got a good lesson on American government.

    The insolent Armenian letter writer, in asking the White House to interfere with the decision of U.S. Court of Appeals or evaluate a California State Law interpretation as superior to Federal Laws and U.S. Constitution, in effect, was forcing the U.S. Government to violate written bilateral agreements with the sovereign Republic of Turkey. Thus, the deceptive and tiny Armenian lobby was indirectly attempting to manipulate American foreign policy. Excuse, but in simple words, this is like “the tail or tail tip wagging the dog”!

    The expression, such as “Genocide era wrongs”, is not based on any judicial decision, but is set on “hearsay and forgeries” promoted deceptively by biased persons or organizations. My book has hundreds of examples. Armenians also fail to understand that hasty campaign pledges and responsibility of an office may differ after election, and sometimes diametrically opposing things. Overall, American interests always trump preferential or actually discriminatory demands of specific ethnic groups or lobbies! That said, a responsible, truth-defending President, is expected to investigate deeper any pledges made during election campaigns and refrain from unrealistic, untrue, unethical, unequal or biased pledges.

    The “Armenian Genocide” allegations are not supported by the verdict of any “competent tribunal” as set forth by the 1948 U.N. Convention. Such terminology, therefore, is not more than a political statement based on hearsay, forgeries, falsifications, fabrications, distortions, and outright lies. Not every killing or suffering is genocide. Not every war crime or hate crime is genocide. Not every photo, tall tale, documentary, film, book is genocide. Genocide verdict can only be given at a competent tribunal after due process where all sides are given a fair chance to tell its side of the story and cross-examine the evidence and witnesses. This was never done in the case of Turkish-Armenian conflict. Armenians are trying to bypass legislation by applying political pressure. But it will not work! They will never come out on a bilateral commission of investigation or scholarly evaluation. On the contrary, the U.S. records in archives bear plenty evidence that the exact opposite is true, or that brutalities were mutual and mostly inflicted by the ancestors of the claimants as evidenced by their own books and historians!

    Armenian propaganda organizations such as ANCA, should be aware of the fact that the new Turkish Republic had agreed with U.S.A. on Dec. 24, 1923 to study all claims and compensate for the actual losses suffered by the U.S. Citizens, until that date. Their absence of knowledge is proof of their blind antagonism!

    ANCA should also be aware that a joint Committee had been empowered with another agreement dated October 25, 1934 and all U.S. citizens or claimants were given a deadline to submit their claims and evidences. The claims that had been submitted were meticulously verified. A further agreement of “Adjustment of Payment” No.168 dated Sept.8, 1937 was concluded with Turkey. U.S.A. confirmed with letter No.93, dated Sept..23, 1937 to the Republic of Turkey, that “…when the agreed amount is paid, Turkey will be fully discharged of the obligations previously agreed…”:

    Turkey had fulfilled the agreement; claimants had been accordingly paid and USA has no longer any lawful rights to request , 72 years later, additional indemnities for cases studied and settled in 1937!

    Accusing U.S. Governments for “complicity on genocide denial” is an arrogant insult to USA and Turkey, as long as the humiliation of “genocide” stands as a word in the air, never decided by a competent tribunal!

    ANCA organization does not have the immunity to call other parties “criminal”, unless the “crime is proven and the judicial verdict is at hand”. Declarations by some Parliaments or other legally irrelevant and/or unauthorized groups are political and have no judicial merit. They may stroke Armenian egos, but are, otherwise, worthless gestures of bias and bigotry, which are used as asset or assessment for collecting “donations for the cause”!..

    Vague expressions and accusations such as “race extermination or over 1.5 million Armenians lost their lives” stands much short of truths and the U.S. state archives refute them openly because:

    a- “American Military Mission to Armenia” (General Harbord) Report 1920 and Annex Report Nat. Archives 184.021/175 do not mention any “race extermination” but instead refer to “refinements of cruelty by Armenians to Muslims”.

    b- Joint US-Congress Resolution no. 192, April 22, 1922 relative to the activities of Near East Relief ending 31.12.1921, has unanimously resolved that 1,414,000 Armenians were alive. Moreover, (George Montgomery) a member of the US delegation at the Paris Conference had presented a detailed tabulation in 1919, with 1,104,000 Armenians alive, apart from those who had already immigrated to other countries.

    c- Reliable sources show that THE TOTAL ARMENIAN POPULATION in the (1914) Ottoman Empire was less than 1.3 MILLION (or up to a maximum of 1.5 millions) and hence it would be ANCA’s liability to “defy and annul these official U.S. State Records,” and give documentary evidence of which number is to be trusted!

    ANCA is charging the Obama administration of “blocking legal redress of U.S. citizens” without minimal proof. ANCA should be aware of the fact that the Obama administration is responsible for protecting the rights and interests of all true American citizens who took an oath when they were naturalized. In other words, the Obama Administration cannot be held responsible for losses such as of life, property, or inheritance by her citizens in “former countries” (before they were naturalized) from where they immigrated to the US! Prevailing cases of U.S. citizens were promptly settled by former USA Administrations at that time. This does not limit the “U.S. citizens from pursuing their personal claims individually in other countries” under their own liabilities. USA cannot disregard or deviate from her written obligations in international agreements under any ethnic pressure or others, such as by ANCA.

    If ANCA lobby organization is disappointed because Obama treats American citizens of Armenian ethnicity equally with all other American citizens and cannot extend special privileges to ANCA, then I am afraid, ANCA is giving priority to ANCA leaders’ private interests over the interests of American citizens over all.

    There is no place for any prejudice or antagonism in USA’s relations with other countries. It is hard to understand or justify why Armenian community is so fearful of “any type of investigation” (by historical commission or others) unless, of course, there are facts that Armenians do not wish to be brought into the light.

    Obama Administration has taken an oath to serve all American citizens, equally, and to protect their overall interests. A U.S. president cannot support unproven allegations or hearsay that may tarnish American values like justice, fairness, openness, honesty, equality, and compassion for all. The Obama Administration, I hope, will never be part of “any prejudice or antagonism” against any ethnicity, nation, race, or faith on earth!

    I welcome ANCA’s offer to discuss “these matters personally in greater detail” when Armenian falsifiers would support White House’s desire to hear what “other American citizens” may have to say equally in a fair, friendly and civilized conference!

    Most Cordially and Sincerely,

    Sukru Server Aya

    [Author: “The Genocide of Truth” ISBN 978-975-6516-24-9 Istanbul Commerce University Publication 2008]

    Annex:
    a- ANCA’s letter to the White House
    b- Book separately mailed from USA, marked on envelope (Annex of the letter by Sukru S. Aya )

    NOTE: The Armenian Community in Turkey and many Armenians in the world, who can see the personal ego and financial interest of the diaspora, are disturbed by the latter’s arrogance and fomenting frictions on which they thrive! My friends and I are dedicated to decency, truth, reason and compassion and despise “hate merchants”

    c.c.:
    a- U.S.A. Embassy – Çankaya – Ankara (Book formerly presented)
    b- U.S.A. General Consulate – Istanbul – – – – – – -do-
    c- T.C. Dışişleri Bakanlıgı (Foreign Office) Ankara – – -do-

    ***

    And here is the letter written by ANCA, the same organization previously headed by a convicted Armenian terrorist, Topalian, who shamelessly stored explosives next to a school, daycare, and a gas station in Ohio until caught in the act by the FBI:

    ***

    ANCA’s letter to Obama
    The Honorable Barack Obama
    President of the United States
    The White House
    1600 Pennsylvania Avenue, NW
    Washington, D.C. 20500

    Dear Mr. President:

    I am writing to urge you to take immediate steps to publicly reject the flawed ruling of a three judge panel of the U.S. Court of Appeals for the Ninth Circuit in the case of Movsesian v. Versicherung A.G. (No. 07-56722, August 20, 2009), that struck down a California law providing remedies for Armenian Genocide-era wrongs, and argued that state level recognition of this crime contradicts “express federal policy” and is therefore unconstitutional.

    You bear direct responsibility, Mr. President, by virtue of your failure to keep your repeated, crystal clear pledges to recognize the Armenian Genocide, for the Court’s judgment that it is the official policy of the Executive Branch of the United States government to actively oppose proper recognition of this crime and, upon this basis, to thus prohibit states from passing laws to help Armenian Genocide-era victims seek to reclaim lost or stolen property. The Court’s interpretation of your broken promise marks an unmistakable and historic low in our government’s long complicity in Turkey’s campaign of genocide denial.

    As you know, over 1.5 million Armenians lost their lives and, of course, many more were deprived of their property as a result of the Ottoman Turkish government’s systematic and deliberate campaign of race extermination. It is particularly tragic, given the thorough understanding that you have articulated regarding the moral, historical, and political meaning of this crime, that, it is under your leadership that the United States government is today not only engaged in complicity in genocide denial, but also, according to a judicial ruling, actively working to ensure that the remaining survivors and their families are denied avenues to seek to reclaim property lost during these massacres.

    Your Administration’s policies, as understood and affirmed by the Court, in addition to blocking legal redress for U.S. citizens, have now opened the door—in unprecedented and profoundly dangerous ways—for interests aligned with the Turkish government to seek to roll back several generations of American civil society efforts to mark this tragedy, including through formal recognition by 42 U.S. states. As such, we once again urge you to publicly reject the Court’s interpretation of your Administration’s position and call upon you to honor your covenant with American voters to properly recognize the Armenian Genocide.

    In closing, I would like to stress to you, once again, how broadly and profoundly disappointing your failure to honor your many commitments on issues of special concern to Armenian American citizens has been for the ANCA, a grassroots organization that, based upon your track record and series of publicly stated commitments, enthusiastically endorsed your candidacy and successfully mobilized an unprecedented community drive to help secure your election. In the wake of your many broken campaign commitments, your silence in the face of this profoundly misguided judicial action would compound the Armenian American community’s sense of betrayal regarding your Administration’s behind the scenes efforts to block adoption of the Armenian Genocide Resolution, your White House’s use of Turkey’s cynically-inspired “roadmap” to defer U.S. recognition, and your State Department’s shameless pressure on Armenia to accept the artificial “historical commission” that Ankara has long advanced to prevent the proper recognition of this crime.

    We remain ready, as we have shared with you on a number of past occasions, to meet with you to discuss these matters personally and in greater detail.

    [signed]
    Kenneth V. Hachikian
    Chairman

    ***

    The Honorable Barack Obama
    President of the United States
    The White House
    1600 Pennsylvania Avenue, NW
    Washington, D.C. 20500

    Dear Mr. President:

    This is to refute the baseless claims and arrogant demands made by the Armenians in a letter to you recently. Kenneth V. Hachikian, chairman of ANCA –the same organization previously headed by a convicted Armenian terrorist, Topalian, who shamelessly stored explosives next to a school, daycare, and a gas station in Ohio until caught in the act by the FBI—

    The discourteous Armenian letter was urging you to reject the ruling of the U.S. Court of Appeals for the Ninth Circuit in the case of Movsesian v. Versicherung A.G. (No. 07-56722, August 20, 2009), which found a California partsian law providing remedies to ethnic Armenians in life insurance matters during an alleged genocide. This bizarre demand, a clear evidence of lack of understanding of American government, totally contradicts the separation of powers in U.S.A. The impolite Armenian letter also seemed clueless about the federal supremacy law, which stipulates that state laws cannot void or overrule federal laws.

    Demanding that the U.S. Government violate bilateral agreements with the sovereign Republic of Turkey by asking the White House to interfere with the decision of U.S. Court of Appeals is simply un-American.

    Furthermore, the term genocide is not based on a verdict by a competent tribunal and reflects a biased interpretation of WWI events, ignoring the six T’s of the Turkish-Armenian conflict [i.e. tumult (revolts), terrorism, treason, territorial demands, Turkish suffering, and TERESET, temporary resettlement order of May 27, 1915.] Not all killing, suffering, and war crimes are genocide. For a genocide verdict, intent of the perpetrator must be proven at a competent court after due process. That was never done in the Turkish-Armenian conflict. The “Armenian Genocide” allegations are political charges based on hearsay, forgeries, falsifications, fabrications, distortions, and outright lies. Turks suffered, too, at the hands of Armenians and the U.S. archives of the era can attest to that.

    Most importantly, ANCA should learn that the Turkish Republic had agreed with U.S.A. on Dec. 24, 1923 to investigate and redress all claims of losses suffered by the U.S. Citizens, until that date. A joint Committee, empowered with another agreement dated October 25, 1934, did collect and verify all submittals, upon which a third agreement of “Adjustment of Payment” No.168 dated Sept.8, 1937 was concluded with Turkey. U.S.A. confirmed with letter No.93, dated Sept..23, 1937 to the Republic of Turkey, that “…when the agreed amount is paid, Turkey will be fully discharged of the obligations previously agreed…” Turkey had fulfilled the agreement by paying the claimants and the matter was permanently and irrevocably settled.

    If you ever decide to meet that nagging, demanding, deceptive ANCA, please do yourself a favor and invite us, Turkish-Americans, as represented by ATAA, FTAA, and others, to the same meeting and let us dismantle their bogus Armenian claims effortlessly… and with pleasure.

    Sincerely,

    Ergun KIRLIKOVALI
    ATAA, President-Elect
    FTAA, Western Regional Director
    ATASC, Past President

  • FLASH NEWS! ARMENIA TAKES TURKEY TO INTERNATIONAL COURT OF JUSTICE!

    FLASH NEWS! ARMENIA TAKES TURKEY TO INTERNATIONAL COURT OF JUSTICE!

    ERGUN KIRLIKOVALI

    Turkish Forum Danisma kurulu Uyesi

    ——————————————————————————————————-

    Just kidding…

    That could never happen, although perhaps it should, as that is the only way to expose the Armenian hearsay and forgeries.

    That is the only way Turkey can clear its name in the face of Armenian lies, deceptions, fabrications, falsifications, and misrepresentations. The 1948 U.N. Convention also required that genocide verdict can only be rendered by a “competent tribunal” where it is proven beyond a showdown of doubt that there was an “intent” to commit genocide. Activists, columnists, academicians, clergy, politicians, and million other professions are free to be heard as witnesses if called upon, but the ultimate decision BELONGS TO THE COURTS.

    Why do I stress that? Because none of the Armenian claims can stand the scrutiny of a court room…not even a single one!

    Case in point: US federal judges recently threw out a California law passed by Glendale Armenians via racist and dishonest politicians which allowed the so called heirs of bogus survivors of a bogus genocide could sue the insurance companies for life insurance policies purchased by Ottoman Armenians. Whoosh! What was that? It was the sound of Armenian claims going out the window… Armenian genocide lies finally hit the wall of truth…
    (Check the archives for details on when, where, who, why, etc.)

    We know this. That is why we are saying, writing, demanding that Armenians, if they truly believe in the crap they spread around as genocide, they should sue Turkey at ICJ in the Hague. I dare them!

    The rest is talk… cheap talk!

    But they cannot!

    Do you now know why Armenians can never take their claims of genocide to court to convict Turkey?

    Because the Armenians know that the Armenian genocide claims do not have a snowball’s chance in hell to withstand the scrutiny of a courtroom.

    ***

    If they did, this is how that lawsuit at ICJ would start:

    Your honor, poor starving Armenians…

    Objection!

    unarmed, Armenian civilians…

    Objection!

    were killed by Turks….

    Objection!

    In 1915…

    Objection!

    systematically…

    Objection!

    And with intent to annihilate…

    Objection!

    to the tune of 1.5 million…

    Objection!

    Armenians had no weapons…

    Objection!

    Armenians were loyal citizens…

    Objection!

    Armenians did not revolt…

    Objection!

    Armenians did not demand territory…

    Objection!

    Armenians did not resort to terrorism…

    Objection!

    Armenians did not join the country’s enemies…

    Objection!

    Armenians did not join the invading enemy armies…

    Objection!

    Armenians were innocent…

    Objection!

    No one helped Armenians…

    Armenian homeland…

    Objection!

    And Armenian national identity…

    Objection!

    (blah…blah…blah…)

    ( Objection!… Objection!… Objection!… )

    …

    See, the Armenians would not be able to finish even a SINGLE FULL SENTENCE without being interrupted after every word/phrase by extremely VIGOROUS TURKISH OBJECTIONS…

    Racist and dishonest Armenian version of history at the hands of equally racist and dishonest politicians like Schiff, Pallone, Radanovich, do not face responsible opposing views in political platforms and can pass easily with a show of hands. In none of the 20 or so countries’ parliaments or 40 some US States’ assemblies did those racist and dishonest Armenian resolutions pass without considerable Armenian political pressure. Meaning, if Armenians did not push this hard, no one would give a damn!

    Pay Schiff, Pallone, Radanovich, and they will sign any resolution created by Armenians. That is why Armenians go for political resolutions rather than courts, because they can manipulate the facts in the former, but not the latter.

    Not all killings are genocide… Not all teresets (temporary resettlements) are genocide… not all my-granma-told-me stories are genocide…Not all human suffering is genocide… Not all man’s inhumanity to man is genocide… Not all war crimes are genocide…

    You see, there has to a proven intent for any of the crimes to be a genocide (that’s what the 1948 UN Convention says)

    And the verdict belongs to ICJ, the only competent tribunal that can effortlessly rip apart the unreliable collection of Armenian hearsay and forgeries.

    That is the plain truth…

    And that, my friend, you can take to the bank!