Tag: Ergenekon

  • Nancy Pelosi: “We are all Armenians!”

    Nancy Pelosi: “We are all Armenians!”


    House Speaker pledges to fight on for Genocide recognition

    by Emil Sanamyan

    Published: Wednesday April 21, 2010

    Speaker Pelosi speaking at April 21 congressional commemoration. The Armenian Reporter

    Washington – “Tonight we are all Armenians!” House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) declared as she began her address at the annual congressional commemoration of the Armenian Genocide on April 21.

    “We are tired of the story being told [about why Congress should not adopt an Armenian Genocide resolution] but we are not tired of fighting for the truth,” Pelosi insisted as she spoke in front of some 200 people, mostly Armenian Americans.

    Speaker noted the importance of last month’s House Foreign Affairs Committee vote on the Armenian Genocide resolution that “insisted on the truth” and expressed hope that the vote was “of some comfort” to Armenian Americans.

    Pelosi added that she and other supporters of affirmation would not rest until the federal government clearly recognizes the Armenian Genocide, but she made no commitments about bringing the House resolution to vote, a move that is opposed by the Obama Administration.

    She also referred to last year’s court decision in California that used the U.S. government position as justification to deny Armenian Americans an opportunity to collect on WWI-era insurance policies of their ancestors.

    The event organized by co-chairs of the Armenian caucus Frank Pallone (D-N.J.) and Mark Kirk (R-Ill.), included House Majority leader Steny Hoyer (D-Md.) and Chair of the House Foreign Affairs Committee Howard Berman (D-Calif.) and more than a dozen other members of Congress, including two members of Armenian descents Reps. Anna Eshoo (D-Calif.) and Jackie Speier (D-Calif.)

    The event also featured remarks by Armenia’s Ambassador to U.S. Tatoul Markarian, Artsakh’s Representative Robert Avetisyan, and invocations by the Armenian Church clergy, including Archbishop Oshagan Choloyan who offered an opening prayer for the House of Representatives earlier in the day.

  • FIRST RESPONCE TO TURKISH FORUM FROM FETULLAH’S REPORTERS

    FIRST RESPONCE TO TURKISH FORUM FROM FETULLAH’S REPORTERS

    Is Fethullah Gulen a dangerous Islamist or a moderate visionary?

    His critics perceive Gülen’s benign face as a mask — one disguising an Islamist wolf in a moderate sheep’s clothing. But who is Fethullah Gulen, really?

    For more than a decade, one of the world’s most influential and controversial Muslim leaders has been convalescing on 26 acres in the Pocono Mountains.

    In Ross Township — not far from the Blue Ridge flea market, a giant corn maze dubbed Mazezilla and a go-kart speedway — you will find a small metal sign bearing the name of the Golden Generation Worship and Retreat Center.

    It is here that Fethullah Gülen, 68, lives.

    Gülen is an ailing Turkish cleric whose vision of an Islam that embraces science, education and interfaith dialogue has earned him millions of followers — and the suspicion of many in Turkey’s secular establishment.

    To his supporters, Gülen is the face of a more contemporary and tolerant Islam.

    But his critics perceive Gülen’s benign face as a mask — one disguising an Islamist wolf in a moderate sheep’s clothing.

    “To his detractors,” wrote Piotr Zalewski, a journalist who lives in Turkey, “he is the second coming of Ayatollah Khomeini, his avowedly peaceful movement hiding a nefarious secret agenda to transform secular Turkey into another Iran.”

    But does Gülen truly pose a threat to national security? And what is so prominent a figure — he was named one of the most influential Muslims alive by the Royal Islamic Strategic Studies Center and the world’s leading public intellectual by the readers of Foreign Policy magazine — doing in northeastern Pennsylvania?

    ‘Most Dangerous Islamist?’

    Gülen’s idyll in the obscurity of the Poconos was shaken by a recent online broadside.

    Bearing the headline, “Exclusive: World’s ‘Most Dangerous Islamist’ Alive, Well, and Living in Pennsylvania,” the article alleged several incendiary details about Gülen.

    Gülen, warned the writer, Paul Williams, lived in an “Islamic armed fortress” in Saylorsburg, had amassed billions of dollars to foment dissent and topple governments and founded madrasahs worldwide to lay the groundwork for “the Islamization of the world.”

    The article, on the website Family Security Matters and on Williams’ blog, The Last Crusade, flew around the Internet, alternately baffling and shocking the center’s neighbors and local officials.

    Though it recycled several longstanding controversies about Gülen, many of its fresher claims are false.

    For example, the article described visits from the FBI. The bureau had been there, but several residents of the center said it was many years ago, during Gülen’s immigration dispute (after a lawsuit, a federal judge granted Gülen status as an “alien of exceptional ability”). The FBI has not been there in years, according to Special Agent J.J. Klaver.

    Williams also quoted unnamed neighbors and business owners complaining of “the incessant sounds of gunfire — including the rat-tat-tat of fully automatic weapons — coming from the compound and the low flying helicopter that circles the area in search of all intruders.”

    None of the neighbors with whom the Pocono Record spoke said they had ever heard or seen what Williams described.

    Instead, they said they’d shared picnics with the center’s residents, and had received visits from them after the terrorist attacks of Sept. 11, 2001.

    The Gülenists had knocked on their doors to apologize for what had been inflicted on innocents in the name of Islam.

    “You couldn’t meet a nicer bunch of people,” said Howard Beers Jr., a Ross Township supervisor who lives next door and enters the property six or seven days a week, often unannounced and not through the front gate, to do construction work.

    “If anyone would walk in on something, it would be me,” Beers said. “As long as I have ever been there, I have never, ever, seen a gun or heard a shot. All this stuff is totally, totally unfounded.”

    Efforts to reach Williams through the Web site and his blog were unsuccessful.

    A recent visit to Golden Generation revealed tranquil surroundings — a retreat, not a compound — landscaped with old-growth trees, a pond, basketball court, soccer field and several residences under construction.

    Middle-aged, mild-mannered, mustached men in modern dress strolled on the grounds, apart from groups of children and hijab-wearing women.

    They bore no weapons — just ornately designed plates and boxes of Turkish desserts, which they offered to American visitors.

    “We are the very opposite of what that man says,” said Bekir Aksoy, president of the center.

    And yet, Gülen is still seen by some as a threat to the established order of the Muslim world. But it is not quite for the reasons Williams described.

    To understand why, the reclusive cleric must be placed in the context of the world’s 1 billion Muslims.

    A threat to orthodoxy

    “The West looks at Islam and says it’s a monolith,” said Akbar Ahmed, a professor at American University’s School of International Service and author of the book, “Journey into America: The Challenge of Islam,” who is supportive of Gülenism.

    But like all large groups of people, Muslims can hold disparate beliefs, observe their faith to different degrees, and embody varying cross-currents and complexities.

    In broad terms, a large number of Muslims belong to the literalist camp. It is typified by the Wahhabi sect of the religion and hard-core Islamic governments like Saudi Arabia’s, which recoil from the influence of the West and see the Koran, the Muslim holy book, as the literal truth.

    At the other end of the spectrum are secular Muslims, such as the Turkish government, who are suspicious of Islam, and see it as a force to be subordinated to the state or kept to the confines of one’s home.

    Between these two poles are other groups, including a small cluster called Sufis, out of whose mystical tradition Gülen arises.

    The Gülenist interpretation of Islam publicly preaches the virtues of being outward looking, peaceful and respectful of religious diversity. If Gülenists are known for anything, it is for their abiding faith in inter-religious dialogue.

    “The Gülen Institute rigorously and, I think very rightly, advocates prayer and interfaith dialogue and the role that they can play in helping ease tensions between peoples in our very complicated world,” James Baker, the former secretary of state, said to a Houston gathering of the institute in 2008.

    They also promote engagement in science and education. While their work has a political aspect — in the sense that many Gülenists are concerned with social justice and communal responsibility — they profess to remain divorced from the hurly-burly of partisan politics.

    “Power’s dominance is transitory; while the dominance of truth and justice is eternal,” Gülen wrote. “Sincere politicians should align themselves and their policies with truth and justice.”

    Gülenism disturbs both poles of the Islamic spectrum — the secular and the fundamentalist.

    “Modern Turkey is self-consciously secular,” said Ahmed. “To them, anyone talking about religion, like Gülen, and appearing to be an attractive and alternative paradigm would be a threat. He would seem to undermine secularism.”

    Ahmed put this threat in starker terms when describing Gülen’s effect on the literalist wing of Islam.

    “If the Taliban had Gülen and George W. Bush in the same room, they’d go for Gülen first,” said Ahmed. “He’d change their society.”

    David Cuthell, executive director of the Institute of Turkish Studies at Georgetown University, went further, saying Gülen was trying to reconcile both poles of thought.

    “If there’s going to be a Reformation in Islam,” Cuthell said, “this is where it’s going to be coming from.”

    The road to Saylorsburg

    Gülen’s popularity in Turkey grew over several decades, through the 1990s. He harnessed the tools of mass communication — television, radio, and now, the Internet — to spread his message of education and engagement, often to well-educated elites, said Muhammed Çetin, a Gülenist, author and sociologist who lives in Wind Gap.

    “He was sending people to learn,” Çetin said, “not to be trapped by terrorists and limited views.”

    Though his influence grew — he is thought to have more than 5 million followers — television proved to be his undoing. Gülen was quoted as urging his followers to weave themselves into the fabric of the power structure.

    “Every method and path is acceptable (including) lying to people,” he allegedly said. Gülen critics have cited these words as evidence that he is orchestrating a shadow conspiracy to seize control and elevate religion.

    Gülen has said the footage was manipulated and that he has no political aspirations.

    Turkey accused Gülen of attempting to undermine the secular regime. His supporters described it as a trumped-up effort to discredit him. The case has never been proven or disproven.

    Tensions mounted. The Welfare Party, which, like Gülen, was pro-religious, held power. But it clashed with Turkey’s military and was dissolved in 1998.

    “Gülen felt like if he stuck around he’d end up in jail,” said Cuthell of the Institute of Turkish Studies.

    At around the same time, Gülen was in Minnesota being treated for ill health. He suffers from diabetes, heart disease and high blood pressure, said Aksoy, president of Golden Generation. Recently, Gülen’s lungs have begun to fill with fluid.

    Golden Generation had already been established in Saylorsburg on the grounds of a former summer camp. Kemal Ozgur, a microbiologist and Gülenist, met Gülen in Minnesota and invited him to stay in Pennsylvania. The cleric has remained there ever since.

    Gülen seldom speaks publicly or appears outside his room. He will leave only to visit a group room in a chalet in the center, where he leads prayers five times daily.

    “He doesn’t want to be in the limelight, and Pennsylvania works for him quite well,” said Cuthell.

    But Gülen’s continued influence is reflected in a decentralized global network of schools, newspapers and think tanks that are supportive of his views.

    Those who run the center refer to Gülen as their guest, and say the entrance is monitored to keep Gülen from being flooded by visiting Turks.

    “He liked it so much, he never left,” Aksoy said. “It was an accident of history that he came here.”

    By Dan Berrett, Pocono Record Writer

  • FETULLAH : ISLAMIC SOLDIERS INVADE SAYLORSBURG PA.

    FETULLAH : ISLAMIC SOLDIERS INVADE SAYLORSBURG PA.

    FETULLAHIN GELISINI MUHAFAZAKAR  BIR HIRISTIYAN AMERIKA VE LAIK  TURKIYE  ICIN BUYUK BIR TEHLIKE OLARAK GOREN  BIR ORGANIZASYONUN WEB SITESINDEN ALINMISDIR. YAZININ ICINDE, BU WEB SITESI,  GORUSLERINI TURK ALEYHINE IRKCI YORUMLARA KADAR UZATMISDIR. BILGILERINIZE……

    ISLAMIC SOLDIERS INVADE SAYLORSBURG PA.

    COMMUNITY UNDER SARACEN SURVEILLANCE

    OBAMA TURNS BLIND EYE TO MUSLIM FOREIGN MILITIA IN PENNSYLVANIA

    by

    Paul L. Williams, Ph.D.

    Christian militias have been raided in Michigan and Ohio. Its members rounded up and tossed in prison. Its cache of weapons confiscated.

    But a well-armed Muslim militia – – composed not of American citizens but foreign militants – – operates under the noses of federal and state law enforcement officials.

    If you doubt it, pay a visit to Saylorsburg, PA, in the heart of the Pocono Mountains.

    “These guys use fully automatic weapons – – AK-47s – – for target practice,” one local businessman says. “We called the FBI but nothing has been done to stop them.”

    “The Muslims have been here for years,” another resident says. “They’ve been engaged in training for guerilla warfare.”

    The Muslims in question are Turks who occupy a 45 acre compound that is owned and operated by Fethullah Gulen.

    Entrance to the compound is forbidden to outsiders.

    Sentries remain on duty – – day and night – – at a hut before the wide metal gate. Within the hut are high definition televisions that project images from security cameras.

    Residents complain of a low flying helicopter that circles their community in search of any un-wanted intruders to the property.

    At the heart of the compound is a massive chalet that serves as Gulen’s residence.

    Gulen has been identified as one of the world’s richest and most powerful Muslims – – and also as the most dangerous.

    From his base in Pennsylvania, he has been responsible for the replacement of the secular government in Turkey with an Islamic regime.

    With assets in excess of $30 billion, he has wielded political allegiances in Washington that have resulted in the placement of Turkish Muslims in the CIA, NSA, FBI, and other national security organizations.

    He has created well-heeled lobbies to promote the cause of Islam and to develop Islamic candidates for political office.

    He has formed close friendships with Bill and Hillary Clinton, former Secretaries of State James Baker and Madeleine Albright, and George W. Bush.

    He has also established over 90 Islamic schools (madrassahs) throughout the United States, where students are indoctrinated in the tenets of political Islam. These charter schools are funded by American taxpayers.

    One school – – Tarek ibn Zayed Academy (TiZA) in Minnesota – – has been so radically Islamic and subversive in nature that the Minnesota Department of Education issued two citations against it and the American Civil Liberties Union is suing it.

    The purpose of every Gulen school, according to the Middle East Media Research Institute, is train Muslim students to become lawyers, accountants, and political leaders so that they can take an active part in the restoration of the Ottoman Empire and the Islamization of the Western World.

    Gulen also imports thousands of graduate students from Turkey – – at the expense of U.S. taxpayers – – to study at American universities. More foreign graduate students in the U.S. hail from Turkey than from any other country.

    Several of these students live at the compound and serve as guards and paramilitary officials. They do not wear skullcaps or Islamic garb but rather business suits with white shirts and ties.

    One, encountered by this reporter on a recent visit, attended Marywood University in Scranton, PA; another studied at East Stroudsburg University, several miles from the compound.

    Gulen’s stated dream is to restore the Ottoman Empire and a universal caliphate.

    He fled Turkey in 1999 to escape arrest for creating a terrorist organization – – the Fethullah Gulen Community.

    He received protection from high-ranking officials of the Clinton and Bush Administrations, who believed that Gulen could play a decisive role in the struggle over Central Asia’s oil and gas wealth. This belief was based on the premise that Muslims within the newly created Russia republics could be swayed away from the influence of Iran and Shiia Islam by Gulen’s doctrine of Sufi Ottomanism.

    With CIA aid, Gulen established hundreds of madrassahs and cemaats (Islamic communities) not only in his native Turkey but such places as Uzbekistan and Turkmenistan.

    Gulen’s triumph over his secularTurkish foes came with the election of November 3, 2002, when the Justice and Development Party (a party which he created from his base in Pennsylvania) gained control of the Turkish government.

    Turkey’s Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan is a Gulen disciple – – as is Turkey’s President Abdullah Gul.

    Thanks to such Islamists, Turkey has transformed from a secular state into an Islamic country with 85,000 active mosques – – one for every 350- citizens – – the highest number per capita in the world, 90,000 imams, more imams than teachers and physicians – – and thousands of state-run Islamic schools.

    Despite the rhetoric of European Union accession, Turkey has transferred its alliance from Europe and the United States to Russia and Iran. It has moved toward friendship with Hamas, Hezbollah, and Syria and created a pervasive anti-Christian, anti-Jewish, and anti-America animus throughout the populace.

    Gulen presents himself as a humanitarian, a moderate Muslim, and a proponent of interfaith dialogue.

    But a visit to the compound provides an opposite impression. The property is off-limits to all visitors and intruders; it is guarded by radical Turks who seek to establish a universal caliphate whose jurisdiction will include the USA, and the Golden Generation Worship and Retreat Center, which supports interfaith relations, is a sentry hut.

    But Gulen is a master of deception.

    In one of his directives to his followers, Gulen proclaimed that in order to reach the ideal Muslim society ‘every method and path is acceptable, [including] lying to people.’”

    In the past five years, several attempts have been made by The Department of Homeland Security to deport him. But in 2008 a federal court ruled that Gulan was an individual with “extraordinary ability in the field of education” who merited permanent residence status in the U.S.

    Strange to say, Gulen lacks any formal education and three of the letters attesting to his “extraordinary ability” came from CIA agents.

    Fethullah Gulen has powerful friends in the West. Tyranny is always better organized than Freedom.


    From Babbazee:

    Also mentioned is the interesting connection with Fethullah Gulen. It says that the Gulen Gang and the Ihlas Gang have close, insider connections. This would mean that Grossman, as a consultant to Ihlas, and a vice-chairman of The Cohen Group, is that much closer to Gulen and his Nurcular. If you don’t know about the Nurcular, there’s an excellent little backgrounder on Gulen and his gang here, by Aland Mizell.

    From Mizell’s article, Gulen operates way behind the scenes, something that he began at least as far back as Turgut Ozal’s time. Ozal, the guy who negotiated the Turkish-Islamic synthesis with the Turkish general staff, was a member of  Gulen’s Gang. You might ask, why would the official gatekeepers charged with maintaining the purity of Kemalism go along with the creation of this synthesis? Simple. They thought they could control it, kind of like they thought they could control their creation of Turkish Hezbollah. Their attitude is that if there will be communism in Turkey, they will bring the communism. Ditto on Islamism. When it became clear that Gulen was intent on taking control of the state from the Turkish general staff, the pashas were willing to do whatever was necessary to maintain their power.

    With that, Gulen high-tailed it to the US, where he sits now, in control of the same network that spreads the same ideology that has turned Turkey into a highly anti-American place (as well as highly anti-semitic). Let’s not forget that Gulen’s network is worldwide. Given the connections that we are digging up on the Deep State in America, it is no longer so surprising to see Gulen safe and sound under the sheltering wing of his American protectors.


    Isn’t it fascinating about all the good dirt that never makes it into the American media? Again, why is that?

    I wonder what Sibel Edmonds would say?

    Tags: Barack Hussein Obama, Creeping Sharia, Fethullah Gulen, Homegrown Jihad, Illegal Immigration, Islamic Conquest, Post-America, SAYLORSBURG PA.

    22 Responses to “ISLAMIC SOLDIERS INVADE SAYLORSBURG PA.”

  • In Turkey, military’s power over secular democracy slips

    In Turkey, military’s power over secular democracy slips


    Sunday, April 11, 2010

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    A power struggle between Turkey's Islamic-rooted government and  its secular military presents a defining moment for a key Washington  ally.
    A power struggle between Turkey’s Islamic-rooted government and its secular military presents a defining moment for a key Washington ally. (Burhan Ozbilici/associated Press)
    Mustafa Kemal Ataturk, the founder of modern Turkey, set its  military-political order.
    Mustafa Kemal Ataturk, the founder of modern Turkey, set its military-political order. (Associated Press)
    slideshow bot

    By Janine Zacharia
    ISTANBUL -- Since the Turkish republic's founding 87 years ago, the military has stood as unquestioned guardian of secular democracy, intervening when it deemed necessary to keep religion out of politics in this overwhelmingly Muslim nation. But now, battered by allegations of corruption and scandal, the authority of the once-unchallenged military is being whittled away by an increasingly assertive and confident public. The critics are a diverse array of democracy advocates, head-scarf-wearing Muslim women, journalists and others who complain that the military's grip on power has largely benefited wealthy and secular elites. Old taboos are collapsing amid the new questioning of a military-political order established by revered national founder Mustafa Kemal Ataturk. Ceren Kenar, 25, a graduate student in Istanbul, recalled marching in the streets of Ankara to protest against a blunt military foray into domestic politics in 2007. She said that when she wasn't detained, "that was the moment I knew Turkey had changed." Turks now freely discuss and criticize the military. Most remarkably, senior officers, once immune from any kind of prosecution, have been arrested in an alleged conspiracy to oust Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan's party from power. A secret organization The officers are accused of taking part in an underground organization, known as Ergenekon, that allegedly plotted to overthrow Erdogan after he was elected in 2002. The arrests have deeply demoralized and rattled the military upon which Washington depends. The United States wants Turkey to continue with democratic reforms, but it also wants its military to remain a strong, reliable ally in the region. President Obama signaled the importance of Turkey -- which borders Iran, Iraq and Syria -- a year ago when he made it his first international destination as president. After visiting Ataturk's tomb, Obama told the Turkish parliament that the founder's "greatest legacy is Turkey's strong and secular democracy.'' That legacy is at the heart of Turkey's current power struggle.
    Erdogan is pushing a major overhaul that would amend the country's 28-year-old military constitution with reforms including changes to statutes covering the prosecution of military officers. In a recent poll, 58 percent of respondents said Turkey needs a civilian constitution compared with 20 percent who said it doesn't. Three months ago, a law was passed limiting the military's role to guard against external threats rather than perceived domestic ones. The Turkish military is not clearly controlled by civilian leaders -- unlike that of the United States, where the president is commander in chief of the armed forces. "The Turkish army chief of staff doesn't consider himself subordinate to the minister of defense. He does not consider himself subordinate to the prime minister, either,'' said Yasemin Congar, 43 and editor of Taraf, the two-year-old Turkish newspaper that has broken most of the Ergenekon stories. "In Turkey, the elected governments have never been the real power,'' she said. "That's what's changing now. It's kind of an unwritten law that they always abide by the military. It's the founder of the republic, guardian of the regime, guardian of secularism. Now it's changing a bit. But it's a very, very hard process." Because of her dangerous central role publicizing the Ergenekon plot, Conger travels with bodyguards. She is careful not to take the ferry to work across the Bosporus, the beautiful strait that splits Istanbul and separates Europe from Asia, presumably for fear that she could be assassinated and dumped overboard. Ergenekon is maddeningly complex and filled with pulp-fiction plots such as alleged plans by the military to blow up mosques to create chaos. Some Turks say the stories sound too fantastical to be real. But many others say that they ring true in a nation where the military has a history of orchestrating coups to oust governments it doesn't like. For many, the most startling aspect of Ergenekon is that it is discussed at all, and that the military has not been able to quash it. "The significant thing about Ergenekon isn't that it's happening -- because there's some amount of truth behind some of these allegations,'' said a Western diplomat in Ankara who spoke on the condition of anonymity. "The significant thing about this is that they've managed to resolve these things up until now without any kind of crisis.'' Beyond more open criticism of the military, society is shifting in more subtle ways. Symbolic change Ataturk's image is still just about everywhere, but when Turkey issued a new currency last year, the founder of the republic was put on only one side of the bill rather than both. The military no longer guards the parliament building, a symbolic change. Still, the military has many fans who believe it has nobly guarded against religion undermining the nation's secular character. Many here suspect, for example, that Erdogan wants to turn Turkey into an Islamic state. Critics cite Erdogan's push to allow women to wear head scarves at state universities -- a major political issue here -- and to make adultery illegal. He failed at both. His advocacy of taxes on tobacco and alcohol, both prohibited under Islam, also raised red flags. Erdogan's biggest political problem may be that he has failed to convince much of the traditional elite that he won't take away their secular freedoms. One prominent critic, retired Brig. Gen. Haldun Solmazturk, said he doesn't trust Erdogan to make decisions that will preserve Turkey's secularism. Still, many Turks are questioning whether Ataturk's vision is appropriate in modern, diverse Turkey, a burgeoning economic and regional power with aspirations to join the European Union. Kenar, the Ankara graduate student, predicted that protests against the military's dominant role in society would continue to grow. "The overuse of Ataturk created a generation like mine,'' she said.

  • Turkish EU Minister on the Armenian Genocide Controversy

    Turkish EU Minister on the Armenian Genocide Controversy

    ‘We Are Very Sensitive About This Issue’

    Photo Gallery: 3 Photos
    DPA

    In a SPIEGEL interview, Ankara’s Minister for European Affairs Egemen Bagis discusses Turkey’s journey to the West and his country’s dispute with the United States over a resolution on the genocide of the Armenians recently passed by Congress.

    SPIEGEL: Mr. Bagis, why does Turkey still need a minister for European Union affairs? Isn’t Europe a dead issue in your country?

    Bagis: Absolutely not. My government is investing more energy in the reform process than any other government. In 2013 we will be ready for accession.SPIEGEL: But do Turks share your enthusiam? Three out of four Turks believe that the EU wants to divide your country and spread Christianity.

    Bagis: I have other figures: If Turkey held a referendum today on accession, 60 percent would vote for it. On the other hand, only 40 percent of Turks believe that accession will definitely take place. In Europe it is the other way round: Forty percent want to take Turkey in, but 60 percent believe the country will join the EU one day.

    SPIEGEL: In other words: There is skepticism on both sides.

    Bagis: Let’s put it this way: Some countries like Malta apply for membership and are in the next day. Others need a little more time. I have no problem with the fact that some Europeans say they want negotiations with an open-ended outcome. Today everything has an open-ended outcome, even Catholic marriages.

    SPIEGEL: Turkey has been seeking EU membership since 1959. Is it not humiliating to be held at bay for so long?

    Bagis: No, because we also made mistakes. There have been three military coups since 1959, and many Turkish government’s didn’t have a clear vision or idea of Europe. It was the Justice and Development Party (AKP) government of Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan that first made the necessary constitutional amendments between 2002 and 2004 so that we could finally start accession negotiations.

    SPIEGEL: Only 17 percent of Germans support Turkish membership in the EU.

    Bagis: Believe me, one day Europeans will have to appeal to the Turkish public to support EU membership. Europe has many problems. Tell me, for example, how the EU plans to solve its energy crisis without Turkish help? A large part of the future energy resources Europe needs will flow through Turkey. And tell me how you are going to solve your economic and demographic problems? The average age in Europe is 40, while in Turkey it is 28. Where are you going to get your work force from? Who is supposed to pay your pensions?

    SPIEGEL: As long as declared opponents of Turkish accession like German Chancellor Angela Merkel and France President Nicolas Sarkozy are in office, you won’t get very far with such arguments.

    Bagis: I am very thankful that German Foreign Minister Guido Westerwelle has publicly stated that he wants accession talks to continue. With regards to President Sarkozy: He used this horrible, insulting phrase, “privileged partnership” …

    SPIEGEL: … a term that was actually coined by Germany’s conservative Christian Democratic Union party.

    Bagis: But Sarkozy repeated it often enough. My government has only one answer: We will only accept full membership — nothing more, nothing less. We want the same chances as every candidate country.

    SPIEGEL: Atatürk, the founder of modern Turkey, said: “The Turks have only ever gone in one direction — towards the West.”

    Bagis: And that is still true. But at the same time, we are also a bridge and have four strong pillars, one in each direction …

    SPIEGEL: … of which you recently pulled out two by recalling your ambassadors to the United States and Sweden. The move was triggered by the decision of a Congressional committee to pass a resolution recognizing the death of more than a million Armenians in 1915-16 as genocide. A similar resolution was passed by Sweden’s parliament.

    Bagis: With this decision, Sweden has become slave to a thesis that, unfortunately, is based on falsehoods. The voting in the US on the so-called genocide was a success for Turkey. The Congressman from California, who got support from the Armenian lobby, made a fool out of himself. He tried to scratch the back of every Representative in the corridors of Congress in order to get their vote. But then he only won by a single vote.

    SPIEGEL: Still, a Congressional committee approved the resolution.

    Bagis: Secretary of State Hillary Clinton later declared that the resolution will not be passed by the entire House of Representatives. As you know, the French parliament passed a similar law on the so-called Armenian genocide in 2006. Afterwards there was a ban on French airforce flights over Turkey. We are very sensitive about this issue.

    SPIEGEL: What options do you have if the Americans do, in the end, recognize the genocide officially? Would you want to close the Incirlik airbase? Leave NATO?

    Bagis: I will leave that up to your readers’ imagination. But allow me to remind you of one thing: Seventy percent of the logistical support for the Iraq deployment comes through Incirlik.

    SPIEGEL: Why is it so difficult for Turkey to recognize the genocide of the Armenians?

    Bagis: It is up to the historians, not politicians, to judge what happened in the past. Politicians look into the future. We have offered to create a joint commission of historians together with the Republic of Armenia — so far without success. Besides, you should know that the Ottoman Empire was an ally of the German Reich. Nothing that happened back then happened without consultations with the Germans.

    SPIEGEL: If you dont accept the word “genocide,” then how can you have a “Genocide Museum” in the city of Igdir in eastern Turkey, dedicated to the Turks who died in 1915?

    Bagis: That’s very easy: Every action leads to a reaction. But I don’t want to rule out the possibility that, someday, this museum could be transformed into a “Museum of Coexistance” or a “Museum of Mutual Pain.” I do not want to deny that the Armenians went through very difficult times …

    SPIEGEL: You call it “difficult times”? We are taking about 1.5 million Armenians who perished between 1915 and 1917.

    Bagis: According to American historian Justin McCarthy, 600,000 Armenians died at the time — and at the same time, 2 million Kurds and Turks. There was a civil war in Turkey, right in the middle of World War I.

    SPIEGEL: The interior minister at that time, Talat Pascha, told the then US ambassador, Henry Morgenthau, that the “physical extermination” of the Amernians was a necessary goal of the war.

    Bagis: According to McCarthy, this quote isn’t entirely accurate. But I am not a historian. I wasn’t there, you weren’t there. Why don’t we leave this question to a mutual commission of historians comprised of Armenians and Turks?

    SPIEGEL: There was a time when Turkey seemed further along the road toward confronting its past. In 1919, the three men mainly responsible for the Armenian genocide — Talat Pasha, Enver Pasha and Cemal Pasha — were all sentenced to death in absentia. Atatürk wanted nothing to do with them. Nevertheless, there are still three large, magnificent tombstones for these men in Istanbul.

    Bagis: It is traditional in our culture to commemorate the dead. Like all of us, these men surely did some good and some bad things in their lives and for their country.

    SPIEGEL: Is Turkey worried the Armenians will demand reparations?

    Bagis: You know, there are an estimated 100,000 illegal Armenian immigrants in our country, who work here providing care for the elderly and children. For me, this shows that there is no hate between our people. On the contrary: We are attempting to achieve rapprochement, there is a peace process between our countries …

    SPIEGEL: … which is stagnating at the moment.

    Bagis: That is not our fault. We have attempted to bridge our differences; we want to open all archives. But when you see that the other side is blocking all your attempts, it makes you skeptical.

    SPIEGEL: This issue represents one of the few on which the AKP government, the military and the secular elite are all on the same page. Doesn’t that bother you?

    Bagis: No. My government focuses on solving problems. We want good neighborly relations, also with Armenia.

    SPIEGEL: Turkey’s new foreign policy earned considerable praise, but the country’s domestic policies have been enigmatic for some people in the West. Isn’t your government overplaying its hand in its power struggle with the army? You are no longer arresting only potential putschists, but also critics of the government.

    Bagis: The investigations in the so-called Ergenekon case, where men are suspected of having planned a putsch against the government, are an issue for the judiciary. In the latest progress report, the European Union assesses the investigation as an opportunity for Turkey to further democratize itself.SPIEGEL: Others see signs of continuing Islamization. Restaurants are losing their alcohol licenses, young people are being harassed for holding hands in public and Family Minister Aliye Kavaf has described homosexuality as a “disease.”

    Bagis: I do not agree with her, I do not consider homosexuality to be a disease. But I am neither a historian nor a doctor. Besides, I really don’t think that Turkey has become more conservative. It just so happens that the conservatives are a lot more visible today than they were previously.

    Interview conducted by Bernhard Zand and Daniel Steinvorth
    https://www.spiegel.de/international/world/turkish-eu-minister-on-the-armenian-genocide-controversy-we-are-very-sensitive-about-this-issue-a-683701.html

    __._,_.___
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    The Gulen Movement: Civic Service without Borders
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    Product Description

    This book seeks to develop an appropriate discourse for studying the Gulen Movement and phenomena like it. The established discourse concerns itself with social movements as protest, as challenge to the System, as contentious actors looking to alter or even overturn existing structures and/or policies in some field, usually political or economic. Approaching the matter from social movement theory and taking an insider's perspective, the author argues that the Gulen Movement is, as it has always been, non-contentious' it is not a marginalized actor working on the System from the outside. On the contrary, it has always worked within the System - within the boundaries of the laws and public norms that obtain in the different local and national settings where it has set up institutions.

    Product Details

    • Hardcover: 344 pages
    • Publisher: Blue Dome Press (May 16, 2010)
    • Language: English
    • ISBN-10: 1935295012
    • ISBN-13: 978-1935295013
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    • Amazon.com Sales Rank: #602,122 in Books (See Bestsellers in Books)
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