J-Lo cancels controversial north Cyprus show

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19 responses to “J-Lo cancels controversial north Cyprus show”

1. 

   rum

   July 10, 2010

   I’m greek and I was opposed to that gig for two main reasons:
   1. When an artist visits an occupied by an army place, he/she automatically recognizes the regime, which the occupational army has imposed. In that way, his/her fame can be used for propaganda, so that the regime can continue to exist, although it has been condemned by the UN council. And that was the real objective of that gig.
   2. Nobody has the authority to invite people in a place, which is not even their property. The hotel is built on stolen land.

   My proposal to the Turkish people, who really want the good of the Turkish Cypriots, instead of cursing JLo is the following:
   Help Cyprus be reunited. A solution that can be mutually accepted by both greek and turkish cypriots should be found. In my opinion, the solution will be instantly found, as soon as Turkish occupational army leaves the island. In the EU-environment, neither human nor political rights can be violated. Even if greek cypriots are “mean” towards the turkish cypriots, they will condemned by EU-authorities.

   Note: I don’t think that it was the Greek-cypriots who achieved the cancellation of that show. I think that the jewish lobby is much more powerful than you imagine. See Clinton’s visit to Yerevan, US attitude towards Kurdish problem etc.
2. 

   Robert

   July 11, 2010

   RUM:

   Either you’re high on some drug, or you’re just plain stupid, or both (your certainly are brainwashed)! Wake up and smell the coffee! Turkey acted legally in accordance with the 1960 Tri-Lateral Treaty signed by England, Greece and Turkey, which states that any one of these signatory nations may take unilateral action to protect their people on Cyprus! The Red-Breaded Butcher Makarios and his demonic henchmen had planned a total ethnic cleansing of the island of ALL Turks so as to acheive ENOSIS as far back as the late 1950’s, and started his program in 1960 (under the guise of the infamous AKRITAS PLAN). His terrorist groups, the EOKA-A and the EOKA-B murdered thousands of Turks. My oldest sister was visiting her friend in Cyprus (Famagusta) in 1965. She was staying at her friend’s parents home. One evening, her friend’s parents went out for a social event, leaving the two girls alone. They were both only 14 years old! They were playing records in the house when a group of EOKA-B thugs entered the home and brutally raped both of them. Then, when they had finished, they horribly mutilated them both. My sister died at the scene. her friend survived long enough to make it to a hospital and to identify their attackers. She too died later that night from her injuries. Of course, the police were Greek and so did absolutely NOTHING! Then more and more Turks dissapeared as well as murdered outright. When Allah could take no more of the genocide being committed by the Greek-Cypriots, he liberated the remainder of the suffering Turks by the 1974 liberation! It was soon after that the world’s media recorded and showed to the world so many Turkish bodies being exhumed from shallow mass graves, with their hands tied behind them! Then, one year later, these very same Greek-Cypriots shamelessly took the exact video clips from the media and CLAIMED that those bodies were really Greek and not Turk! At that point, the UN had many condemnations against the Greek-Cypriots (especially agter they assinated the American Ambassador to Cyprus in Nicosia). The military junta in Greece collapsed also at that time. Why do you think that the world still remembers the saying “Never Trust a Greek Bearing Gifts”! Your animalistic conduct is no different than your Armenian breathren! Life has little meaning to either one of you. You know as well as the entire planet does that as soon as Turkish troops leave Northern Cyprus, the murders of Turkish-Cypriots will begin once again, just as they had from the 1950’s until the liberation in 1974. The EU will of course do nothing when the killings begin (why should they, you people, just as your Armenian partners in the commital of genocides, are both Christian! The EU is made up of Christian nations! Turkey is a secular Moslem nation! The EU has no intention of admiting Turkey [Never had and never will]). And if you check history, you’ll find that there was no stolen land, as you people and Armenians always like to claim (defeated losers who are envious, jealous and very frustrated, having a low self-esteem, always use this tactic). Cyprus was part of the Venitians, then the Ottomans for over five centuries! How was it stolen? So tell us, given all of this information, what part of all of this do you not understand? Turkey will work with Greece proper, but never with Greek-Cypriots (just last month 300 Turkish businessmen and representatives went to Greece to help them with their economic troubles)!! Also, for your edification, it WAS the Greek-Cypriots, working with the Armenian dashnak diaspora, who inundated the Morris Agency (who represents Ms. Lopez) with threatening telegrams, e-mails, phone calls to demand that they cancel the event!! How quick you are to blame the Jews, aren’t you!! Will you also call them eveil Zionists, just as the Armenians have done for so long? Why not…after all, the Armenians have been your puppets for years! People like you disgust anyone with even a modicum of decency! Go back under the rock you crawled out from! Look at yourself before you dare point a finger to anyone else!!! Loser!!
3. 

   rum

   July 11, 2010

   So, your lack in arguments makes me stupid, brainwashed, “high” etc. Interesting!

   First of all, you seem to forget the Treaty of Lausanne. You know…the treaty that established the modern Turkish state. In that treaty, Turkey resigned of any territorial claims on Cyprus. Then, when EOKA A started the resistance against the British occupators of the island, the British government decided to get Turkey back in the “game”, in order to “divide and conquer” the local population. So along with the Turkish government, it provoked the Istanbul pogrom in 1955 through unreal “news” about Kemal’s house in Thessaloniki. Also, many Turkish Cypriots collaborated with the British occupators against their greek neighbours. That’s how the 1960 Tri-Lateral Treaty was eventually signed.

   Secondly, Makarios was not the one who organised the coup against himself (!) but EOKA B, an organisation backed by the unpopular, supported by the US, junta in Greece.

   Thirdly, I can neither doubt nor accept your story, cause I didn’t witness it. But, in the same way, I could support that all the rapes and murders of Greek cypriots between 1960-1974, were commited by Turks, but there is no proof.
   However, such sad incidents are not an excuse for the murders and rapes commited by the Turkish army in Cyprus. Spreading the responsibilities of a group of people (EOKA B) to all the Greek Cypriots, is pure fascism.

   Fourthly, if Turkish army had invaded to protect the Turkish Cypriots, they ‘d have left by now. Why iare they still on the island, although Cypriot and Greek junta regimes have collapsed since July 1974? Why don’t they let the UN-Casques Bleus to protect them? What about the settlers from Turkey? Whom do they protect?
   So, is it all about protection, or does Turkey want to play the same role that Israel plays in West Bank and Gaza strip?

   Fifthly, you claim that after a reunification, there will be murders by the Greek cypriots etc. How many Turks were killed by Greeks the last 36 years? Do you know the number of Greeks murdered (even live on tv) by Turks? Do the names Tasos Isaak and Solomos Solomou remind you anything?

   Sixthly, Armenian and Pontic-greek genocides are facts. How can EU deny the truth? Also, why EU condemned the massacre of Srebrenica? Were Bosniaks christians too?

   Seventhly, a country belongs to its people. Venetians and Ottomans were conquerors, since Cypriot population has been mainly greek-speaking since 1000 BC.
   Anyway… I didn’t refer to Cyprus in general, but to the place where the hotel is built. It belongs to Greek Cypriots.

   Last but not least, I didn’t blame the Jews. That was a compliment for their diplomatic power.

   Note: The exact phrase is : “Timeo Danaos et dona ferentes”(Dedicated to the 300 Turkish businessmen…)
4. 

   Hally

   July 13, 2010

   Good for J Lo. The hotel owner has rightfully sued her for $40M for breach of contract.

   Rum, the island will never be joined. It will remain separated because it seems Greeks cannot seem to get over their ethnocentric superiority, which they used as justification to murder innocent Turkic villagers in the Balkans and then later in Cyprus.

   Rum, you’ve got bigger problems than Cyprus. Your government is bankrupt and about to sell off some of your islands to pay your public debt.

   Hey, maybe we Turks can help out and buy a few islands from you. So many of them–especially those within spitting distance of the Turkish mainland– used to belong to us before WWI anyway. Wouldn’t that be “poetic justice”…
5. 

   rum

   July 16, 2010

   The island will be reunified, as soon as Turkish Cypriots understand that they are being exploited by their nationalist “brothers” from Turkey.

   There were no innocent Turkic villagers in Rumelia (the land of Rum, as you used to call the Balkans). Ottomans were conquerors and behaved as conquerors. The Ottoman Empire used to discriminate people according to their millet. That’s why Serbs, Bulgarians, Romanians, Albanians and Greeks revolted against the Ottoman Empire. However, in Cyprus, the conquerors after the Ottomans were the British and their collaborators (Turks, Greeks, Maronites or whatever) got what they actually deserved.

   My response to our “bankrupcy” and your “greek islands sales” theory is this (again): Timeo Danaos et dona ferentes…
   You know, we were at the same point in 1893. Then, in 1897 we lost, indeed, a war to the Ottoman Empire… but 23 years later, there was no Ottoman Empire and Greece had doubled its area… And that was no “poetic justice”, but “tragic irony”!
   Thanks for caring so much about our “bigger problems”, but take a look at Eastern Turkey (or northern Kurdistan or whatever), before spending your money to “help” us…

   Anyway. My objection to that show was not about any hate on behalf of me for Turks, but about international law which has been violated on Cyprus since 1974. I don’t hate Turks… I hate nationalist and imperialist practices on behalf of any nation, government or army (even the greek one).
6. 

   Robert

   July 17, 2010

   Rum,

   after reading some of your posts here, you do have some interesting points. The tri-lateral treaty made it quite legal for the 1974 liberation. The arguments used by Greece saying that it was “illegal” is due to a combination of despeartion and frustration, in which they state that turkey used American equipment and hardware. Would the liberation have been made less “illegal” had they purchased and used Soviet and/or Chinese made equipment? You’re grasping at straws and suffer from a bad case of SOUR GRAPES! Just get used to the fact that the Northern sector is now, and will continue to be, Turkish! BTW, prior to the Ottoman Empire acquiring Cyprus, it was controlled by the Venitians. It hadn’t been in any Greek hands since Alexander!

   You speak of international law. How many laws were broken when the massacres of the Turkish-Cypriots began as early as the 1950’s and continued until 1974? From the early 1950’s to 1974, Turks were treated as second class citizens (how many times would their water be cut, or they’d be robbed at Greek roadblocked checkpoints). Greek-Cypriots used the same tactics in 1974 that the vietcong did against the US during the Vietnam war. They fired upon Turkish planes from hotel AND even hospital rooftops, and then hid amongst the civilians! Thr Greek terrorist group EOKA-B raped and murdered my older sister in 1965 when she went to visit her girlfiend and her family, who were living there, for the summer. She was only 14. Thr friend’s parents had gone out for a few hours when the EOKA-B broke in, raped both girls, then brutally mutillated them. My sister died at the scene. Her friend lived long enough to be discovered and taken to the hospital. She described the attackers in detail. Less then a day later, she too died from her injuries. Of course, the police being predominantly Greek, did absolutely nothing. What a surprise. I can live with the Greeks in Greece, but the Greek-Cypriots in Cyprus are a totaly different story!
7. 

   Hally

   July 19, 2010

   Rum,

   Interesting anecdote for you. A friend involved in international conservation efforts visited some old Greek villages in the Balkans two years ago. One of the old Greek villagers came to speak to this friend bringing out his rusty old Turkish. You know what he told my friend?

   This old Greek villager said he missed the old days, that when they lived under the Turks they didn’t even suffer from a bloody nose as compared to the current regime in Greece. He also was puzzled why the Turks would ever want to join the EU, which he felt had imperialist goals. He felt Turkey was better at leading disparate people and should form its own union of states.

   PS – The reason Bulgarians, Serbs, Greeks, etc. revolted against the Ottoman Empire was because the British and Russians encouraged the psychopathic elements in those societies to start killing innocent villagers– similar to what occurred in Sarajevo in the 1980s. Their aim was to sabotage the Ottoman Empire and make it collapse from within. It was not the romantic rebellion you seem to think it was.

   What a relief it must have been for those states to live under the oppressive rule of the communists that came after the Ottomans. Remember how all who lived in communists states were either imprisoned or killed for daring to want freedom to worship? freedom to speak? freedom to immigrate?
8. 

   rum

   July 20, 2010

   “This old Greek villager said he missed the old days, that when they lived under the Turks they didn’t even suffer from a bloody nose as compared to the current regime in Greece.”
   And then a UFO arrived, Tony Blair came out and sung “La isla bonita”. lol
   So you found the only man on earth being nostalgic for his time of being a slave. Interesting…

   “He also was puzzled why the Turks would ever want to join the EU, which he felt had imperialist goals. He felt Turkey was better at leading disparate people and should form its own union of states.”
   I don’t that Turkey will “survive” to form its own union of states. See at your eastern part…

   “PS – The reason Bulgarians, Serbs, Greeks, etc. revolted against the Ottoman Empire was because the British and Russians encouraged the psychopathic elements in those societies to start killing innocent villagers– similar to what occurred in Sarajevo in the 1980s.”
   http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greek_War_of_Independence#Greeks_under_Ottoman_rule
   You see, the 1821 revolution was not unique. A series of unsuccessful revolutions took place from 1453 to 1821. Also greek autonomous guerillas (klephts) acted constantly on mountains, sabotaging the Ottoman authorities.

   “Their aim was to sabotage the Ottoman Empire and make it collapse from within. It was not the romantic rebellion you seem to think it was.”
   It wasn’t romantic at all. But Greeks, Bulgarians, Serbs etc. exploited the desire of Great Powers to fight indirectly the Ottoman Empire. Their formal position towards such revolutions was hostile (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Congress_of_Vienna#Participants).

   “What a relief it must have been for those states to live under the oppressive rule of the communists that came after the Ottomans. Remember how all who lived in communists states were either imprisoned or killed for daring to want freedom to worship? freedom to speak? freedom to immigrate?”
   That’s not communism. That’s modern Turkey. (Halki school, Istanbul pogrom 1955, persecution of Rum minority in Constantinople-Imvros-Tenedos, Ocalan, political prisoners, murders of christian-catholic priests, murder of Armenian journalist etc.) By “freedom to immigrate”, you mean the expatriation of 200,000 Greeks-Cypriots from their homes in Northern Cyprus?
9. 

   Hally

   July 21, 2010

   @ whoever tried to mascarad as “rum” on July 20-

   RUM posted above that he hates nationalists, presumably for their lack of logic and love of hate.

   You would be a fine example of such a beast.

   Who cites wikipedia, a social website where the public edits entries in whatever way they want with no oversight by scholars, but those too ignorant or lazy to read a text book?
10. 

    Hally

    July 21, 2010

    @ whoever tried to masquerade as “rum” on July 20-

    RUM posted above that he hates nationalists, presumably for their lack of logic and love of hate.

    You would be a fine example of such a beast.

    Who cites wikipedia, a social website where the public edits entries in whatever way they want with no oversight by scholars, but those too ignorant or lazy to read a text book?
11. 

    Robert

    July 23, 2010

    Hally,

    You have wisdom beyond your years! I always look forward to your posts. Great job as always.

    To Rum who posted on 7/20,

    Careful, your last sentence especially places you on thin ice with me!!!
12. 

    Hally

    July 26, 2010

    @ Robert – Thank you : )

    It never ceases to amaze me how people who love to hate Turks cannot see what a horrific tragedy befell the people of the Balkan states after the Ottoman Empire fell.

    Russia’s brand of communism crushed for over 40 years all semblance of independence and/or freedom of any kind the Christians of the Balkan thought they were going to get by ethnically cleansing or killing off their Ottoman Muslim neighbors.
13. 

    rum

    July 26, 2010

    “RUM posted above that he hates nationalists, presumably for their lack of logic and love of hate.”
    Don’t presume anything. I don’t hate them “for their lack of logic and love of hate”. I hate them because they’ve always been my enemies. Besides, they’re too rational when they want to make people suffer.

    “You would be a fine example of such a beast.”
    I don’t think so…
    Hello…I’m not a “Grey wolf”!

    “Who cites wikipedia, a social website where the public edits entries in whatever way they want with no oversight by scholars, but those too ignorant or lazy to read a text book?”
    Do you speak greek? I have no problem to give you extracts of many history books in greek.
    Anyway… My objective was not to make you agree with what is written on wikipedia, but to show you that other revolutions did happen before the last one. The myth that non-Ottomans had a “great time” while being under Ottoman rule is just a myth.
    So, which of these revolts do you doubt? Or do you doubt the Congress of Vienna after Bonaparte’s fail? If you doubt any of those historical events, look at the Ottoman files. You’ll find your answer…

    “Careful, your last sentence especially places you on thin ice with me!!!”
    I don’t give a damn…
    However, I think you should direct your anger towards those who “allow” me, with their actions, to judge your country.
14. 

    hally

    July 26, 2010

    @Rum – You are more like a “Grey wolf” than anyone else commenting on this article.

    You would do well to read your own wikipedia citations in their entirety. For example, the first citation you provide includes this gem–

    “At the same time, a number of Greeks enjoyed a privileged position in the Ottoman state as members of the Ottoman bureaucracy. Greeks controlled the affairs of the Orthodox Church through the Ecumenical Patriarchate of Constantinople, as the higher clergy of the Orthodox Church was mostly of Greek origin. Thus, as a result of the Ottoman millet system, the predominantly Greek hierarchy of the Patriarchate enjoyed control over the Empire’s Orthodox subjects (the Rum milleti[12]).[2] The Greek Orthodox Church played a pivotal role in the preservation of national identity, the development of Greek society and the resurgence of Greek nationalism.iii[›] From the 18th century and onwards, members of prominent Greek families in Constantinople, known as Phanariotes (after the Phanar district of the city) gained considerable control over Ottoman foreign policy and eventually over the bureaucracy as a whole.”

    Sounds really really horrible. Greeks ruled themselves in communal affairs and got to preserve their national identity. How absolutely horrid of the Ottomans to permit them to do that!

    Stop being so SELF/HATE-centered and understand this: Bulgarians, Romanians, Croats, Serbs, Bosnians, Kosovars, etc. lived a horrible existence of oppression under communism. Their lives were without a doubt better and freer under the Ottomans than under the communists that came after.
15. 

    rum

    July 27, 2010

    “@Rum – You are more like a “Grey wolf” than anyone else commenting on this article.”
    I don’t think so… “Grey wolves” (according to Kemal’s dogma) use to present themselves as pacifists. I don’t believe in pacifism. I believe that peace can exist only when people face the truth. When people try to forget or distort their past, sth strange is going on.

    “At the same time, a number of Greeks enjoyed a privileged position in the Ottoman state as members of the Ottoman bureaucracy. Greeks controlled the affairs of the Orthodox Church through the Ecumenical Patriarchate of Constantinople, as the higher clergy of the Orthodox Church was mostly of Greek origin. Thus, as a result of the Ottoman millet system, the predominantly Greek hierarchy of the Patriarchate enjoyed control over the Empire’s Orthodox subjects (the Rum milleti[12]).[2] The Greek Orthodox Church played a pivotal role in the preservation of national identity, the development of Greek society and the resurgence of Greek nationalism.iii[›] From the 18th century and onwards, members of prominent Greek families in Constantinople, known as Phanariotes (after the Phanar district of the city) gained considerable control over Ottoman foreign policy and eventually over the bureaucracy as a whole.”
    I totally agree with this article. Every nation includes a great variety of people. Some of them only care about power. In the case of Phanariotes, there are two subcategories: some belonged to the prementionned category and others were the most qualified to do the job the sultans wanted.
    As far as the Ecumenical Patriarch is concerned, he was necessary to the Sultan to govern the christian subjects. If he did not exist, the revolutions would start the next day after the occupation of Constantinople.

    “Sounds really really horrible. Greeks ruled themselves in communal affairs and got to preserve their national identity. How absolutely horrid of the Ottomans to permit them to do that!”
    Have you heard about the taxation of the muslims and the taxation of the christians in the Ottoman Empire? What about the “devşirme”? What about the political and human rights of non-muslims (and occasionally of muslims) in the Ottoman Empire?
    If all these are heaven, then I wish you to live the rest of your life as the christians did during the Ottoman occupation!

    “Stop being so SELF/HATE-centered and understand this: Bulgarians, Romanians, Croats, Serbs, Bosnians, Kosovars, etc. lived a horrible existence of oppression under communism. Their lives were without a doubt better and freer under the Ottomans than under the communists that came after.”

    That’s neo-Ottoman propaganda. It’s better to be governed as a citizen by a bad government, than to be governed as a slave by a good government. Turks (fortunately) have not lived as slaves the last centuries. So you don’t even know what I’m talking about.
    Our “Enlighter”, Rigas Feraios, (who was executed and thrown in Danube, accused of anti-Ottoman action) wrote a poem (Thourios) about our revolting (of both christians and muslims under Ottoman rule) against the Sultan. The following is one of the lyrics of the poem:
    “It’s better to have an hour as a free man than forty years as a slave”.
    (Note: one of Rigas’ best friends was the muslim Bosnian Osman Pazvantoğlu)
16. 

    Robert

    July 28, 2010

    Rum,

    All I can say to you is that I pity you. You’re soul is so full of distorted, misdirected and misguided hate that it’s blinded you to see reality. Do you even know, let alone “give a damn”, about the sufferings of others? I’ll even accept the sufferings which your own people have caused, not only to Turks, but the the Jews and others.

    I don’t hate Greeks. I do have issues with hate-filled Greek-Cypriots though. Their EOKA-B punks raped and murdered my oldest sister in 1965. She was only 14 when she went to visit her friend in Cyprus. Both girls were attacked, raped and then mutilated. Her girlfriend lived long enough to make it to the hospital and identify their attackers. She then died the next morning. The police were made up of mostly Greeks, so of course, they did nothing (after all, what’s a couple of more innocent dead Turks…RIGHT?). So, be careful of what you post in that regard, and yes, you better “give a damn” too!
17. 

    rum

    July 28, 2010

    The expression “I don’t give a damn” is an expression of indifference towards your tactic to doubt what I write (the violent expatriation of 200,000 Greek-cypriots is a fact, whether you think they were devils or not). My freedom of speech is sth I don’t negotiate.

    Secondly, my “own people” have not caused anything to Jews or “others”. On the contrary, during the Nazi Occupation of Greece, when many Greek Jews were deported by the Nazis from Greece, even the christian Archbishop of Athens, Damaskinos, wrote a protest letter to the Nazi authorities and published it, although the local Schutzstaffel commander, Jürgen Stroop, threatened to execute him by firing squad. Damaskinos’s famous sarcastic response to him was:
    “According to the traditions of the Greek Orthodox Church, our prelates are hanged, not shot. Please respect our traditions!”.
    Damaskinos along with other 305 Greeks were honored by the Israeli state as “Righteous among the Nations” for their contibution to the salvation of many Jews, whereas only one Turk is honored with the same honor.
    http://www1.yadvashem.org/yv/en/righteous/statistics.asp#detailed
    Also, don’t forget 1934 Thrace Pogroms and the hanging of the 3 most prominent Jews of Constantinople after the Vaka-i Hayriye (1826), which caused the following pogrom in Bagdad.

    Finally, I do have many moving stories about “innocent Greeks” and “bad Turks”, including members of my family or my acquaintances, but I don’t think this forum is apropriate for such things. My arguments are based on international law, historic events, general facts, data and politics. Not on emotions.
18. 

    hally

    July 28, 2010

    Rum, you just go on hating and believing it was a good thing for the Balkan people to live in a closed off open air prison of their so-called nation-states under communism. At least under the Ottomans, migration was open. Those who were unhappy could leave.

    Hey Rum, wanna know why Orthodox Christians didn’t leave the Ottoman Empire and actually fled to it for so long? Because for centuries your Christian cousins, the Catholics, were burning alive throughout Europe any Christian that refused to accept the Pope as God’s representative on earth.

    Meanwhile, the Ottomans left Christians, Jews and Muslims to worship as they wanted since all were considered people of “the Book”. Wow, how horrid of the Ottomans to offer refuge to those who were victims of the various inquisitions.
19. 

    Robert

    July 29, 2010

    Rum,

    Please tell us (guess if you must) just how many Turks AND Jews were murdered by Greeks and Armenians in 1922 in Izmir. My maternal grandfather and his sister went from one burned out house in the sector to another just to survive. They saw the mass murders committed by Greek soldiers and their Armenian puppets, how they set fire to the Moslem/Jewish sectors, destroying any supplies while leaving alone the Christian sector. Other witnesses were a Lt. Neal from admiral Mark Bristol’s command, as well as hundreds of sailors aboard the US ships anchored just off shore. Another witness to the Armenians and Greeks setting fire to the Moslem sector and committing major atrocities, were command staff from a French frigate, which had come to help evacuate the Greek soldiers as Ataturk’s army advanced towards the city. So yes Rum, just as dashnak Armenians murdered Jews during the days of WWI, so too did the Greeks in 1922 in Izmir.